AMCs Take a Sizable Cut of the Appraisal Fee
It still proves my point: Appraisal Management Companies take a sizable Cut of the appraisal fee…
It was March 28th, 2018 that I wrote my very first blog post entitled “What’s not in your wallet?” where I went into great detail about how Appraisal Management Companies or AMCs get paid and how the consumer is not aware of the fact that the AMC is taking much of the fee while finding the cheapest and fastest appraiser.
In that blog post, I gave many examples of the abuse appraisers and consumers are absorbing by these Appraisal Management Companies. How one borrower back then was charged $1,150 for an appraisal where the appraiser was only paid $500 while the AMC kept the rest. Seems pretty insane, right? I mean, how is it that an AMC that is supposed to just manage the order (take the order, assign it, follow up, do some QC control and send to the lender) is making more than the appraiser who is taking on all the liability with their report? Good question.
Now my blog was written in 2018; however, this practice has been going on since 2009 when the Home Valuation Code of Conduct (HVCC) went into effect and is today known as the Dodd-Frank Act. Since I wrote this blog, many things have changed in the appraisal profession.
These changes range from newer cheaper appraisal products, the push for Automated Valuation Models (AVMs), Desktop appraisals where the appraiser doesn’t even visit the home but a third party gathers the subject data, to some regulation changes and new appraisal profession entry initiatives. While the profession is changing in more dangerous ways than good, some things just seem to remain the same, as seen in the photo below.
The AMC sent the above order to an appraiser and even though it’s not as bad as the example I stated above earlier, it still proves my point: Appraisal Management Companies take a sizable Cut of the appraisal fee.
Unfortunately, many believe that this fee is what the appraiser requested but that’s not the case. They sent this order to the appraiser with the fee offered to the appraiser while showing their cut. The AMC charged the borrower $649 but is only willing to pay the appraiser $350. They are making $299 to manage the order.
If the AMC is charging $649 for the appraisal, then wouldn’t this be considered the Customary and Reasonable fee for an appraisal? Also, is the AMC disclosing to the borrowers that the $649 includes the fee for their services? Probably not.
We are in a period of inflation where companies and businesses are raising their costs for services and prices daily. Yet here we are in 2022 and appraisers are subjected to what I call the greatest and most legal Ponzi scheme ever created. It’s 2022 and yet AMCs are offering appraisers the same fees they made back in 2005.
The issue over Customary and Reasonable fees for appraisers under Dodd-Frank is far from settled. What that even means is a mystery to me and probably to you as well. Basically, it means a fee paid based upon what everyone else in your area is accepting or charging. Is there any other profession that has this sort of language or rule? None! What’s sad is no one has a clue how to decipher what this means, not even the people who created it. Typical political garbage. This brings me back to my earlier question. If an AMC is charging a borrower $600 for an appraisal and that borrower believes that is how much an appraisal cost, then shouldn’t $600 be considered the Customary and Reasonable fee? Take the AMC out of the equation. If they are capable of charging this fee, then why can’t appraisers? Why can’t experts charge what they want for their services and not be beholden to a third party that is getting rich off of the experts? Think about the example above. The AMC takes $299 out of the fee. Let’s say they get 5000 appraisals a year across the country. By my math they made $1,495,000 for managing the orders with no liability, no recourse and not doing anything.
Many appraisers like myself have stopped doing lender and AMC appraisals because of this very reason. Many have moved on to doing other things, more private business, or just left the profession. AMCs act as if they add something to the process. Perhaps they do; however, they do not deserve to determine what fee an independent appraiser who runs their own business should take, nor do they deserve to keep misleading the public and consumers.
My final thoughts. It’s time to revisit Dodd-Frank. It’s time to start listening to the hardworking boots on the ground appraisers instead of AMCs. AMCs want to keep the status quo. They will hire the cheapest appraiser to pad their pockets. While appraisers are the target of unprecedented levels of litigation and disciplinary investigation, the AMCs have no liability. It’s time to find other solutions that may include leaving AMCs in place but being paid per order by the lenders they have contracts with. Maybe it’s to take the independent appraisal fee quote out of RESPA and TILA and allow appraisers to get back to wanting to appraise homes instead of seeking alternatives. CFPB, Government, Congress, Fannie, and Freddie need to stop looking out for their friends and donors and start looking for real solutions. Consumers deserve better.
- Look in the Mirror - February 27, 2023
- AMCs Take a Sizable Cut of the Appraisal Fee - October 5, 2022
- Proposed Rule to Eliminate C&R Fee Tabled - July 21, 2022
Hi Mark
Thank you and the AGA for supporting appraisers, greatly appreciated.
Yep, that order is from Solidifi, who specializes in price-fixing. Solidifi engages a local appraiser in an area and promises work if they fix their fees around the $300.00 range. It’s textbook price-fixing and against the law, but it goes on daily.
Specifically RICO violations, industry wide racketeering and restraint of trade. Rules on the books, if only someone would enforce them. Felonious behavior if licensed individuals in many other sectors were to engage in similar billing approaches. Consumer fraud is the name of the game with amc’s. What appraisers have a hard time getting their minds around, is that when the appraiser works with an amc, the appraiser becomes the amc’s additional customer. They could not sell the product without appraisers, and they specifically sell the service to the appraiser. Who is the customer? They’re not dealing with borrowers, being detached from the workflow stream. The staple of the appraisal industry used to use different language; ‘borrowers appraisal services charge’. The achilles heel of the amc bidding game; Q: What’s your fee and turn time? A: What was the borrower charged? 20 something years later, the geniuses in the amc industry have still not found a way to bill separately for their distinctly different service.
The AMC doesn’t WANT to bill seperately…. They want the Appraiser blamed for the high fee and turn times.
If mortgage bankers engaged in a similar accounting method it would be clearly defined as junk fee billing. An illegal practice. The downfall of the amc industry is when one simple rule is enacted; Separated billing practices. Distinctly different bills for distinctly different service.
I stopped working for AMCs about 3 years ago. I do VA, a little general public, and some legal stuff. Over the past 3-4 months I’ve had a lot of the AMCs I used to work for contact me wanting me to start working for them again. On the 1st call, I politely decline and explain why, on any follow-up call I just hang up. The callers usually can’t believe I have such a low opinion of their services.
Race to the bottom! No need to wonder why no one is coming into the profession and why seasoned appraisers are focusing on private work!
Well said!
What grinds my gears is that AMC’s have been screaming appraiser shortage for years , which has led for lenders pushing desktops and other products, but they never mention they spend sometimes up to 3 weeks shopping the order for the cheapest fee, then tell the banks they can’t find an appraiser, when it’s no one will work for that fee. My feeling now is with such a slowdown in volume with rates near 7% many appraisers will get desperate for work and fees will be pushed down more . The next 2 years look rough in our profession!
I do believe you have the sharpest crystal ball of all Ralph. Your prediction will prove to be right on the money. Been there…seen that…many many times.
Very well said, this is one of the reasons that after 50+ years I’m fed up with appraising which I really enjoyed doing.
I have been in the industry for 20 years. The AMC system is horrible (abusive by nature). Does not make sense as a business owner. I stopped using them 10 years ago. I have spoke out against the system. But at this point they are very wealthy companies that make lots of money with little time associated with their work. The USA government does not care.
Appraisers: YOU are our own worst enemy. Some demand a decent fee for their work which is “declined” by the AMC’S. Some appraisers for whatever reason think: “Let them charge more, I’ll charge less and get a greater volume of work”. I have bills to pay. Which of course is true. So now it is “A RACE TO THE BOTTOM”. The question becomes now: Is what you’re doing profitable? Or are you now working for the sake of working and leaving your head on the liability chopping block? Reviews and “buy backs” are increasing. If you’re doing desktop work, you’re also contributing to the end of this profession. Thank GOD I’m nearing retirement age.
Excellent insight Jaydee. So many start out with nothing to lose, so the proposition of discounted service fees make more sense. Where as putting it all on the line for a discount and never getting ahead, risking everything every time you sign… They simply do not yet understand the gravity and liability risk of the service they are providing, being enthralled with finally being ‘independent’ 1099. A quintessential be careful what you wish for example.
If you want insight to what the spanking brand new appraisers are chatting about, simply swing by reddit / appraisal or whatever that landing was, it’s a substantial group. Having no perspective on how this industry used to be better managed before amc mismanagement became the norm, the green thumbs are easy for predatory amc’s to mold and manipulate. Thank goodness that evil appraisal coach finally threw in the towel. He made a big show of it and then the inevitable occurred, something blew back at him, probably in such substantial volume… He copped out with excuses and straight up disappeared like Houdini.
I’ve been hearing since day one how the detailed time consuming appraisal methods are no longer in vogue, and simply will not stand the test of time. That my days are numbered, the writing is on the wall. Yet, I continue to watch the supposed big shots come and go like shooting stars in the night sky, burning out every second of their journey. Until they fade away on the event horizon. Where they go, nobody knows. But I can tell you one thing for sure; they’re gone and will never be coming back to this industry. I do not compete with other appraisers. I compete with the repurchase and liability game. 100% perfect record so far, not a single state complaint or insurance claim. To me, amc fulfillment is just additional long term liability, I quote them higher fees than I would quote for lender direct assignment. Needless to say, an impossible sale, easier to just cut all amc ties.
Likewise, I now have 45-years of no E&O claims, no lawsuits and no Board of Appraisal complaints, discipline or sanctions. No known lender losses due to my work either. Proud of that even though there is almost no work out there right now.
Holy smokes Will, that’s like truly impressive. What is your secret or do you have any tips for us? Wow, normally I’m claiming that at twenty but you’re twice that and then some. I lose sleep at night sometimes thinking of how if a first complaint hits, it may be my last and I’d simply walk away. Thanks.
Hello Mr. Baggins: Of course you know the really simple secret: Just be thorough, competent and honest. That is about it. Maybe lucky too!
Great Job Jaydee. The simple fact is that the vast majority of appraisers are indeed “Working To
Be Working”. They suffer from a little disease known as “Too Proud To Work For Anyone Even Though My Appraisal JOB Barely Pays The Bills”. Unfortunately, there is no known cure for this disease. Well Known Symptoms: Divorce, Addiction, Eviction, Bankruptcy, Suicide, etc.
Thanks Mark. What is the real function of an AMC at this point anyway?? Money Laundering?? The AMC business model will never be satisfied until Appraisers are paying THEM for the privilege to do the work. Any AMC order should be required to have the Appraisers invoice as page 1 of the report delivered to the lender/client. Truth in Lending ?? Give me back my “business” and turn times will NOT be your problem.. Yes, Dudd-Fwank needs a re-write and it’s criminal this hasn’t been addressed in over 10 years!!! Just more insanity from DC and The King Cobras.
I was sent a full 1004 appraisal request yesterday for 2 days and $350. I laughed until I cried.
When you lay out the cards of the appraisal profession, it doesn’t take a rocket surgeon to quickly deduce the writing is on the wall.
Fannie and Freddie’s never ending quest to automate valuations, the issues of TAF and ASC, the over-reaching and abusive state boards, useless and unnecessary USPAP changes, the invisible hand of the MBA and NAR pulling strings, the AMC issue. I could go on but it’s all so tiresome.
Sadly, after 22 years I’m actively seeking a viable alternative to this appraisal circus.
FANNIE AND Freddie need appraisers to feed their machines withe the data. Garbage in garbage out
Me too Eric… Quite literally, and this is easy to research and confirm, field management services like lawn mowing pay more than professional appraisal services if operating through the amc service routes. The problem with amc’s is they applied a field services vendor approach to professionals, as if we are only qualified to mow lawns or clean toilets. This article is so well written.
I’m still on with my original position; Direct assignment and full fee or bust. I can’t operate this small business around a question mark. Simply refuse to provide quotes for companies whom otherwise do not send the majority of all assignments out directly to specific appraisers. The illusion of amc’s providing superior fulfillment is fading fast, despite their heavy gravy pr sauce.
It was what like 4 or more years ago when the FNMA white paper on amc quality speculation came forth, and even then, what limited data presented from the CU system total volume of appraisals completed stats, allowed us to infer that half of all licensed appraisers don’t feed anything through the CU system (aka FNMA GSE work), and of that half still submitting work, half of those appraisers had not submitted anything through an amc. aka; Only 1 in 4 licensed appraisers even is willing to work with amc’s. Surely the proportion is continuing to fall.
What should be regulated is the Fee the AMC gets not the appraiser.
The problem is not at the feet of the AMCs. It’s simple business, they see an opportunity and jump on it. Unless the AMC is under contract with the lender to do so, they aren’t going to seek out the most competent. The enablers are the appraisers that accept lower fees. Most mortgage lending use appraisal work is a game of commoditized service. The users of the service are not concerned with most competent, while they should be as they are required to be by their regulators, the simply hide behind the fact the appraisers that they hire are credentials and state they have competency to do the work. Go work for clients that want to work with you not ones that must work with you. Lenders and AMCs want the lowest bar unless you are doing wealth management work and higher level situations. Run of the mill work from the lending sector is hard to compete with if you know how to value and are actually competent to do it. If that is the only work that you do then you have to adapt to what your competition for that work does, which means you will be doing more work for less. It’s a tough situation to be in, and I feel for those that get stuck there. This is why getting designations and learning how to do more complex work and helping clients solve actual problems is important. Everyone was so busy the last few years that many failed to plan for a step down in volume and fees. Be the appraiser that can do work that others won’t or can’t do in your market area. There is a lot of opportunity out there for residential appraisers that are able to secure clients that need their services. It’s just a matter of understanding how to get them to see you and for you to stand out so they can see you.
Well said woody. That’s why I do almost 0 lender work or amc work. So glad I took the advice of some good people 2.5 years ago and began to explore alternatives.
I will also say that while you stated it’s not at the amc level.. it actually is in part and how the laws and lobbying have made this system as such.
Any help on where to look? besides the AMCs?
TIA
You both are right, totally. There are also millions of American citizens and their families out there getting fleeced by corrupted practices and predatory interests in real estate. Private property is a cornerstone of our fundamental liberties. We all have an ethical duty as citizens and licensed professionals to constantly strive for better consumer protection. So yeah, I know exactly where I am at, going it alone the hard way in mortgage lending. Talk to realty agents on purpose? Whoa! Stop the show. Talk to lawyers on purpose… Is this a dream, am I in the twilight zone? Constantly have to drone on about client identification and explain basic principals of valuation service to every single individual whom may shop around for an appraiser… I for one prefer the lending model, even if at times like this, the damned thing is straight up falling apart at the seams. Mortgage lending is the river which always flows, the tide will return. It’s musical chairs now, last man standing. It’s still fun and extra ordinarily easy compared to some of the other challenges you describe. For appraisers whom want to go for gold, perhaps pump up to a CG, the BLM is currently hiring for appraiser development specific programs. Get out there and see the wild spaces, be truly one of the best most skilled in the industry. Just memorize the yellow book before applying. If I bounce anywhere, it will be to a forensic review firm specializing in securatized mortgages from gse’s, crushing lackluster licenses left and right. And I won’t lose any sleep over it either, lol.
Mark, you outdid yourself with this article. Perhaps one of your best ever. Of course, I’m partial to bashing amc’s, it’s my favorite hobby.
Appraisers – my question to you is, WHY are you still working with those AMCs? If you know they are keeping a major portion of the fee, then ‘Speak Up’ say something to the lender that is using that AMC and get them removed.
I was on the mortgage side of the house for years, then when HVCC came around, I helped an appraiser start an AMC before starting my own. In all the years I have been in business, I have been transparent with the appraisers and lenders with fees.
Why not turn those lenders on to an AMC that will be mindful of good business practices?
If you choose to work with AMCs like that – that is on you.
I wish it was that simple. The AMC business represents 98% of residential appraisal business. So you really have little place to run. imagine if you have to pay all you bills and you chose appraising as your career. This is 100% unfair system from the get go….appraiser does all the work.
Jennifer, where are you getting those figures from? Amc’s occupy like three quarters of mortgage lending, and falling. Getting away from them is as easy as broad marketing. Simply find lender lists and then carefully market to all of them down the line, it’s hit and miss. HUD has easy to access lists for approved lenders by state, marketing data for appraisers is so easy to acquire. Keep careful records, make a client folder for every single marketing attempt. Stay organized and years later you can dip back into the stack if you need another one. Just say; keep my information, and if you ever get away from the amc model, I’ll be available. Additionally, there are some lenders whom still to this day have apply to be on our appraisal panel links right there on their website. I could list you no less than a dozen direct assignment lenders whom operate on a national or near national basis right now. Market slowly, the only mistake you can make is landing too many at once. Go through them slowly, keep careful detailed records. Fire every last amc and refuse to work with them ever again. I know there are good amc’s out there, but they’re so few and far between, it’s long since a failed model and not worth the effort. I’d bet you’re on with mercury scope and ap, and get that many quotes. It’s because amc’s use those systems on purpose to exploit appraisers, and the systems owners do nothing to protect appraisers. But if you make a big deal of it and always call into the assignment platforms demanding solutions, behind the scenes, all of those tech systems have ways to turn off the amc bid harassment streams. I am so happy to report that after well over a decade of amc harassment, I have gotten the random quote requests down to less than one a week, sometimes only one a month. They all know better, on account of how frequently I keep telling them in no uncertain terms to take a hike. I’m probably on all their blacklists, but it never mattered to me, I simply pick up the phone for a new direct assignment lender if I need one.
Yep, one AMC I had previously worked for offered me a $600 fee on a refi report and when I contacted the borrower to schedule the appointment he stated there is no Fing way he’s paying $1,200 for a residential appraisal report. He, unlike most others, first apologized for his language then stated he knew that wasn’t all my fee.
Picture me laughing at you guys for still (p)itching and moaning over the same old worn out topic. If I remember correctly I began warning ALL OF YOU on every blog site (remember the Appraiser’s Water Cooler) that it was time to organize and take back your profession. I started in 2009 and ran with the same message for at least five years. By the four year mark I saw that I was screaming at a pack of lemmings who were Hell bent on going over the cliff…and I dropped out. Surrendering my license so I would not be tempted into returning. In response to Jennifer’s message above which states appraisers have “little place to run” I say NONSENSE! The last time I looked the world was full of other JOBS (which is what appraising has become); most of which pay far far better salaries and with far less stress. Pull your head out of the sand Jennifer and take a look around.
So, you still haunt appraisal boards 10 years later?
My firm billed out $400k last year.
Please enlighten us with all these employment opportunities that pay better with far less stress.
Congats on your highly profitable appraisal mill Sir Walter! As for the other opportunities that pay more with less stress. Pick any job in the classified section of your local newspaper.
Newspapers are no longer how peep find jobs
Indeed.com
Google
LinkedIn.com
Usajobs.gov
Government jobs.com
Many others
We do have a skill set that can transfer to other jobs. However as you get older it is definable harder to change.
I am currently looking for other options. I have made a healthy living appraising and mostly because I am good at marketing. The stress has never really impacted me
Skills that transfer are analyst, research, marketing, sales, data collection, teaching, excel….
It may be a good time to get a Masters Degree or Certification in some technology.
But many jobs are lower paying so harder to transfer.
We all are just doing the best we can… in our needs and wants of life before the candle is up.
Guess who’s back! Back again. Tell a friend. Please allow me to jump in here.
A J… Jjjjjjjjj ooooo …… J, J, J, J , Joo, Jrrrr, Jo———-bbbbbbb,,,,, bbbrrrrr, I was just shivering.
I certainly did not say that word! But I’m working on it, might get there eventually, you never know.
“Haunting the appraisal boards….” Genius!
You left out the GUARANTED revisions. Sometimes multiple.
I did the typo on purpose!
Cant we form a Union for appraisers? CBA? OREA?
Answer: No. 99.999% of appraisers have refused to organize in any way since having their “profession” hijacked by the banking industry 13 years ago. 99.999% of appraisers have refused consistently to do ANYTHING to put an end to the rape of their profession by bank owned AMCs. Bottom Line: You either grow a set and jump ship or you make your peace with the thought of making beans for the rest of your life. Those are your ONLY TWO OPTIONS.
My Question For Everyone On This Blog: What have YOU done over the last 13 years to bring down the hijackers that took control of your business? Crickets….
Very well put. And I’m just as guilty as the next guy/girl.
Does a never ending relentless stream of amc hate mail and comment board trolling whenever an amc is mentioned count?
Because that’s, you know, what I do.
Answer: No. Attempting to organize appraisers for years on end (collecting thousands of email addresses in the process counts), writing to every Congress man and woman countless times counts, meeting with leaders of the Senate and House counts. That’s what I did from 2009 through 2013. No need to waste your time now though because you are ten years too late.
One ponders the possible effectiveness of continued pressure, continued exposure, alongside the now broader understanding how destructive the existing policies actually are. Even if the system at large is mostly unaffected, the continued efforts, past to present, has resulted in some individual changes. One lender at a time moved away from amc’s, and that has been enough to sustain some of us. But yeah, you were right, always have been. There is still hope on an individual level. You read my posts, so that’s something.
This one’s for you retired. I need to get off this cheap 3d paint trick, maybe tomorrow.
I have never completed an appraisal for an AMC. I paid off my mortgage (sales price 153k in 1997 current value 500k) I have a new car (paid off next year) money in the bank I can live on for 8 years with no need for additional income. 819 FICO score with no debt. All without working for any AMCs. My retirement is right around the corner.
Oh yea, I get $4000 for a standard 1004, I have 2 week turn times minimum, I get no less than 15 orders a week, Clients pay me weekly even if I dont have the report done, I have a credit score of 1000000, bought my house for $200,000 15 years ago, paid it off in 2 months and now its worth $3,500,600,999.99. I have never HEARD of an AMC. And Without fail in the last 20 years I save an entire family (including all pets) from burning buildings that the fire departments is afraid of going into.
You all wonder why people dont trust appraisers?
You dont understand! I am AMAZING. I am so Awesome, I am an appraiser. Not like a bunch of other appraisers that use the computer to pretend how awesome they are because I really am. I mean look how much more awesomer I am compared to the post above mine! He must be close to awesome right?? I mean why else would someone be so sad as to post such things if it wasnt true?
For those of you who have not listened to the truth I’ve spoken, shot me down when the truth was exposed, ignored the truth, and or sought fake truth from others who just wanted to coach you into their own profits, I say laydown on your bed of nails.
Seek the truth, and or take advice from others who don’t practice what they preach.
Your really impressed with yourself
Not impressed, just have called it like I see it for years Chris.
I dare you to go back and read some old blogs on this site where I’ve even had a back and forth with this author expressing the concerns of AMC’s, and the pitfalls of being coached to include AMC’s in your business model. The truth hurts, but its truth none the less.
Seek the truth.
Wait. You’re questioning my blogs that provide Information and more.? You calling me out yet you are too chicken shit to post your own name and info out there. BILL JOHNSON everyone. So scared to sad. Don’t disrespect me. So you are questioning my character? agree with you in things and disagree yet here I am one of the only people to push the narrative. Where are your blogs? Where are you sir doing anything. Oh that’s right. You just comment and make everyone believe you are amazing. SMH. Garbage
Sorry BILL. while I’ll agree with you in some things, all you do is comment to seek the truth yet do nothing else. You can’t even provide the truth cause your scared. Talk to me when you actually do something or say something useful.
Here are some comments I made to you back in 2019 Mark.
“Not trying to pick a fight Mark, but it was you who referenced the coach first. If you are going to eat your own soup “If it’s bad feedback and the people or companies are terrible to deal with, what are you complaining about if you choose to work with them?”, then with many seeing his actions in a negative way (rubbing shoulder with Joan Trice, support of the AMC model, his completion of 4 to 9 appraisals a day, ect.), perhaps you are not taking your own advice.
Although the intention of the blog in part may focus on say the choice for an appraiser to work with company A, or AMC B (do your research), in general, the theory still works outside of your narrow example (via your comments / choice to work with the coach). If many an appraiser disagrees with one of Dustin’s principles (again, he supports the AMC model) but yet you see the benefit of his services outweighing the many negatives (panel of his peers), then that’s your individual choice to do business with him.
Again Mark, not trying to pick a fight but only offering an opinion of value.
Seek the truth.”
“Seeking the truth, bringing to light the truth, and judging others by the truth (see Dave Biggers own words, Dustin Harris’s support of the AMC model), is not in itself complaining, but rather is bringing to light the reality of ones (others) actions.
You are shooting me the messenger, while making a choice to work with those who many believe have questionable appraiser policy beliefs. Work with who you want, but don’t be surprised if others in part partially judge you by the company you keep.
Seek the truth and when exposed, take action against the offenders instead of the messenger. Order by end of day for free shipping.”
Instead of burning down the messenger then and now (me), perhaps you and others should have listened years ago.
I can support you Mark in different ways, but your guidance from others, and your taste for working with AMC’s over the years is fact.
Also, considering you just commented the following two days ago.
“Well said woody. That’s why I do almost 0 lender work or amc work. So glad I took the advice of some good people 2.5 years ago and began to explore alternatives.
I will also say that while you stated it’s not at the amc level.. it actually is in part and how the laws and lobbying have made this system as such.”
I feel sorry for you that didn’t take my advice and guidance from years earlier telling you and others to get off the AMC dependent train.
Lastly, as it seems you’ve been angry with me for years, I would suggest you take some guidance from this site.
“You may openly disagree, but state your case in an atmosphere of mutual respect, in which everyone has a right to a particular view about the topic of conversation. Please keep remarks about the topic at hand, & PLEASE avoid personal attacks. If the poster gets you upset, it is the Internet, you can walk away from it.
Personal attacks harm the collegial atmosphere we encourage on AppraisersBlogs.”
Seek the truth Mark, or I’ll just remind of it in a few years. .
Every appraiser whom finally sees the light and drops amc’s is one more victory in the epic battle against predatory lending practices. And this article was really good.
Additionally, Bill, I gave you a special nod with the appraisal coach houdini reference above. Want to talk bed of nails, what’s ‘the coach’ up to lately. lol! We really called that one a long time ago. What the hell, building a complete business model to train appraisers to exploit other appraisers and advocate for amc’s? That nonsense was destined to fail, and fail it did, all epic like too.
Per his own words in a podcast some time ago, he ummmm sold his appraisal business, and is a W2 employee for True Footage. I don’t have time to investigate (your good at that), but if they aren’t already a licensed AMC, my call is they soon will be.
On a side note, relating to appraisers and AMC’s, their like the current culture who advocated to close nearly every business, every school, every church, etc., but yet today want everybody to forget what they pushed for.
Again, work for an AMC if you want, but I would suggest treating them like welfare and or a minimum wage job, which means, you should be actively working to rid yourself of the poison.
Seek the truth
O.k., Bill. Internet research is so easy, it just takes time. And I’ve unfortunately got a lot of free time lately.
Is True Footage doing an end run around amc licensing requirements? A national appraisal firm, doling out assignments to all their partner appraisers. How is that any different than having panel appraisers which require amc licensing?
Wonderful. https://www.linkedin.com/company/true-footage
And there is Andrew Perry, again.
https://web.archive.org/web/20230605033510/https://challenge.economicarchitectureproject.org/challenge/
Someone posted a single from this previously, but take a minute to sift through some of the various equitable lending focused sort of proposals. This link below.
https://web.archive.org/web/20230605022007/https://challenge.economicarchitectureproject.org/featured-innovators/
Post edit. Check your email for this post. I just cut it down as it’s off topic for amc’s and I’m droning on about the federal reserve again. Another favorite hobby. In a nutshell though, True Footage appears to be an advocate and supporter of Brookings. Thanks.
I agree that the AMCs have put the screws to the profession. Our office sees fees of $295- $350 but to be honest we quote our fees at $450-$500 with few declines. We do have to watch out for the fees they charge under various names (Tech, delivery fee, ect). Some of them go up towards $35. I was on the Union bandwagon but it just seems like appraisers refuse to pull together while complaining about how unfair everything is. Faith without action is dead. whine, cry and moan about the problems do nothing, action is the only thing that will make change that you want to see happen.
If we could only get the general public to understand.
Unfortunately, many of the most skilled appraisers in this profession are not present to help protect and inform the general public, having backed away from GSE work. We need these guys to get back in the mix, to participate in more GSE work, and contribute to the cause of better systems corrections, honest reform, the eventual abolishment of the failed amc business model. It’s a community effort. Define ‘the general public’ from the appraisers perspective. I believe that is best defined as all the hundreds of millions of regular citizen borrowers whom eventually flow through the GSE avenues. So that’s where I call home and choose to draw the line.
Why would we want to do GSE work if we can make a living not having to deal with the silliness of GSE work? Even lender work with no AMCs involved is often a battle of competing with those that cut many corners instead of doing the work correctly. Even in direct engagement work, appraisers are seen as a commoditized service and an unwanted necessity required by regulatory overlay on the lender. Work with clients that want to work with you, not clients that are required to work with you.
Woody, I have read your sites and much of the content. You’ve got it going on. You’ll one day have to roll through GSE’s as a customer again. Or your kids will. Your pals, your neighbors, people from your community, etc, etc. Who will provide the necessary advocacy to systems reform for better consumer protection if not us?
I’m sticking it in the commoditized zone for the same reason I picked up this license in the first place, American citizens deserve better representation when trying to work their way through the maze which is mortgage lending and home purchasing. And I don’t mind being an unwanted necessity. That’s an illusion as well. We are a necessity none the less. We all pay into the same tax pool these companies are exploiting. That little guy way at the very bottom of the ladder, he’ll appreciate and benefit from your expertise more than anyone else will.
Systems reform extends far beyond lending but it’s still a good place to start. I don’t mind putting in extra effort to help the people I’ll never hear from again. That’s what I choose to do. Lots of respect for the appraisers whom make it work like you’ve been able to. But please don’t forget about the least represented among us, the regular borrowers trying to navigate gse systems.
Do you get Jeremy Bagott’s news letter? His next article illustrates this very point, the systematic exploitation of big banking customers.
You can subscribe here if interested;
https://mailchi.mp/2a23230963ef/jeremy-bagott
I do. Jeremy is a great writer
Thanks for the reply. Fair points all.
Appraisers are only as strong as our weakest link.. and there a plenty of weak links out there. AMC’s spend hours of every day looking for that weakness, it’s called “shopping” fee and turn time. This AMC “business model” is what is corrupt – not the Independent Appraiser working to feed their family. Dudd-Fwank needs a serious rewrite!! Give me back my business as a Professional and turn times will not be your problem. AMC’s are banking $Millions without even having to disclose they exist in the transaction… Truth in Lending?? Nope, I honestly can’t fathom how they have gotten away with this for 12+ years and during a false “Appraiser Shortage”. I want change, but I’m more afraid of what the crazies in DC will come up with next. The Cobra Effect of unintended consequences is a true thing.
Mark performed a bit of math in the article, which is but a tiny slice of how much the amc industry pilfers from the appraisal industry. They’ve raked billions. Money is a powerful motivator. Being locked up in an orange jumpsuit and shackles, an adequate deterrent. What the amc industry has been doing is criminal and it’s time for more people to understand this. They’re not going to turn themselves in. Only our dedicated advocacy and love for our own profession can save us. Of course nobody will go to jail, but we can dare to dream justice will be delivered, and we’ll get these amc crooks off our backs and out of our pockets.
Oh man, I love amc threads. Mark you made my day. I’d better get back to work, how time flies.
This is a must listen!
https://thenationalrealestatepost.com/the-dwindling-pool-of-appraisers/
Well said Brian. TRUTH!!! The Cobra Effect is alive and well in DC and their financial “advisors”>>>>
Yeah, that is a really great 7 minute video. Thanks for the link. Must watch.
The video and message was so good, I made Mr Brian Stevens a special 3d paint meme.
Now I’m sad again. lol
AGREE: 1) Locally the (HUGE) AMC Spotlighted in this article “takes over” an entire area. The Appraiser “is Captured”. Either work for… or get another career. HUGE and where other AMCs follow this “captured” mentality severely impacts The Ability to make a Living. Some Say: Get Better Clients”. A JOKE…locally EVERY appraiser is TRYING to get better clients. Not an “Appraiser Shortage area”.
2) How many times have I been ask by an Angered Borrower “WHY” my FEE is so HIGH. (Label: “Appraisal Fee” doesn’t clearly disclose My typical Fee would be Lower) Where I am unable to Tell the Truth through “confidentially contracts with the AMC & Lender” and even warned within the SOW pages = I look like I am Party to a Scam ! My Response: I am unable to discuss. Please contact your-lender Rep’ regarding the AMC fee “that was hired by your lender”.
AND why, I also am retiring.
In Colorado, this was a primary argument. We are now required, if working with an amc, to disclose the appraisers billed amount within the report. That really did not provide the necessary protection though. But at least eliminated a portion of the restraint of trade issue. I gave up on the amc’s early on when I eventually learned the borrowers were always charged a rather similar amount, regardless of my fee. So why did they even have to shop? The financial incentive. The disrespect of treating us like day laborers. Constantly wasting our time. With many shop focused amc’s, appraisers are literally bribing the amc with increased profits, to be the assigned appraiser. Clear violations of the management rule. Clear violations of federal registry guidance on assignment based on competency and performance. An illegal activity for so many others, undisclosed junk fee billing. As if amc ‘management’ carries such a variable cost, which it certainly does not. The behaviors of amc companies represented an immediate return to predatory lending practices, the similarities were undeniable.
Absolutely not aligned with the spirit of the DF Reg Z C&R rule, which was manipulated by the cfpb to read as something which was certainly not intended. Thousands of appraisers wrote letters to get C&R language installed, we came within an inch of mandated separated billing, as well as amc’s having their own unique line item disclosure on hud1 forms, then tavma lobbyists derailed all of our hard work behind the scenes in back room deals. It happened overnight, the hud1 with the amc line was scrapped, the cfpb fictitious safe harbor interpretation came forth, customary and reasonable became customary or reasonable, and a hundred thousand appraisers threw in the towel.
We’d have been better served to know ahead of time how much the borrower was charged. Back when I did take amc work I’d disclose as I always would prior to amc’s; Order stapled to front of folder, meet and greet, this is my work order, here is my fee, highlighted, etc. Never once was I asked about a high fee, as that was always immediately and up front redirected back to the people actually charging the borrowers card, whom they wrote the check to. What are they going to do about it? Ethic is not so easily re written and client confidentiality is mighty hard to defend in this regard, the borrower deserves to understand all of their billable fee amounts. That’s hard wired into lending, and amc’s don’t get some free pass as if they’re apart from the systems generally understood rules. Those rules are in place to protect the integrity of the process. Amc’s have eroded said integrity by abusing the privilege of their position. aka; predatory activities.
Per better clients, they’re out there, but it’s going to be some time before they really want to onboard new people again. Market contraction is here. I just drained hours of my life which will never return reading banter on the AF. Interesting but hard to participate, such a time sink. I’m more aligned with the pessimists, that it’s not going to just bounce back next spring, but you never know. If housing unravels or softens much more, the appetite for accountability will return. People will walk from their mortgage commitments. That’s when the page turns and it will be a whole new ball game. All it takes is a set of mortgage backed securities going under. And if they are packed full of waivers hybrids or somehow not tied to valuation, no appraisal, they’re not held to valuation repurchase warranty relief sort of deal, hiring a full service human appraiser will be back in style. Taxpayers will cry out, news will respond, someone will be needed to blame, EO insurers will go under. Honk if I’m paying your mortgage, again(squared). It’s all so predictable. If people have yet to comprehend, welcome to the pump and dump economy. They might be able to save it from crashing, entirely unlikely they’ll let it pump again anytime soon.
Solid, as always.
I disagree. I work for an AMC. The owner is an appraiser. We do a lot more than just “manage” the orders. We deal with upset lenders and borrowers/agents. We come up with solutions so lenders can meet their deadlines. We do not charge outrageous fees. Our average Profit from an appraisal after we pay the appraisal web service portal fees, CC/bank expenses, our employees, and other business expenses is VERY slim. We also lose profit when an appraiser somehow messes the order up and we basically have to eat the fee to make it right with the lender. Maybe there are some sketchy AMC’s out there but we have a great working relationship with our panel of appraiser’s and our clients.
Does your amc company bill for the amc management service separately?
Because that is where the problem lies and the line in the sand is.
Want support? We’re ready to get on board, if only there were amc’s whom eliminated the financial incentive to push appraisers wages down (via greed or desperation to maintain a positive margin to sustain operations.)
Cost plus or bust. The amc’s industries poor reputation is their own self inflicted wound.
Baggins, exactly. You always hit the nail right on the head.
Thank you. The irony of imposing such unfair business structure on the body of professionals who’s very existence, is predicated on their ability to recognize what is fair and what is not fair.
I’m in possession of two full legal drawers of amc client files which prove, I’ve never found a single amc that bills for their services separately. It’s like, determine what amount needs billed, carve out a separate bill, and stick with it. I’ll never understand why appraisers are willing to sacrifice their own fee just to keep a completely unassociated company in business. The infinite fee quoting for every single order distributed is a fools errand. The amc’s industry preference to send the lions share to only the lowest priced appraiser is also an unethical practice. It would be fair, if they’d return cost savings of lower priced appraisal service to consumers, rather than pocketing the difference and having a financial incentive to drive down the appraisers fee for variable opportunistic profit, or engage in improper imbalanced distribution of available work flow despite credentials, career length, performance measurements, etc.
Oh boy, I said it again. Logically valid anti amc arguments have become second nature to me, push the basic principals of fair dealings out in my sleep these days. When will the training be complete? It appears, never.
Personally I’d rather be able to access amc services in a fair unbiased manner. That would be very appreciated, as I’d no longer be subject to the financial and career damages, the pervasive restraint of trade, constantly locked out away from the majority work flow stream, which the amc industry and the REVAA trade group in general has imposed upon all of us.
I am with Garett. I have been an appraiser for over 20 years and also own a small AMC. I always push clients to go with cost plus pricing. Some refuse and we do flat fee pricing, with complexity increases. When it comes to flat fee pricing, we make extra profit on some files and no profit on others…in fact, we even lose money on some assignments, but it is what it is. The clients that choose the flat fee pricing understand that the model is not necessarily fair to their clients as some of their clients pay more for their assignment, while others pay less. They choose it because of TRID and disclosure requirements. In every case, our invoice outlines the appraiser fee and the management fee.
I know why AMCs have a bad reputation and there are many that deserve to be shut down. We treat our appraiser’s as partners and our appraisers set their fees. Unfortunately, there are many bad apples in the appraisal industry just like there are bad AMCs. Competency is also a major issue. We have a solid panel of preferred appraisers who’s quality is off the charts and they always follow through. However, there are many appraisers who give false ETA’s, outright lie and do mediocre work. Many of the “problem” appraisers feel they are justified in their behavior because you know, AMCs suck.
I would LOVE to start a group of appraisers and AMC leaders get together to help solve the problems. There are many AMCs still getting away with paying dirt…the giants come to mind. They literally pay $125 (with a 15 tech fee) for their new hybrid 1004. I can’t believe any appraiser would accept that, but they do. We also have AMCs who do not pay their appraisers on time, but they somehow get away with it. If we could all sit down and discuss the issues all the way around, maybe we could clean up our industry and get the bad actors out of the way.
So I’m the example below. Charging the borrower $515.00 and the AMC takes $215.00 to leave $300 to pay an appraiser is just totally acceptable right?
If the AMC is charging $515 and that is what the borrower thinks the cost is wouldn’t $515 be considered customary and reasonable?
While you may work with a good AMC as you state, the fact remains and proven as in this photo that the AMC model is broken and reaping the rewards.
Btw. You mention portal fees. You mean the ones hat get passed down to the appraiser who has to pay $10 and up in order to submit an order? What fees are you paying again?
Hi Mark. Well, per the posters own admission, when an appraiser works for an amc, we also cover their losses when other appraisers fail to meet their engagement obligations and the amc has to cover that cost. Absent of cost plus, every single amc expense comes out of the appraisers pocket. So actually we’re paying fees twice, but are just unaware how much and how often that is happening.
In the previous engagement structure, pre-amc era, when an appraiser failed to perform it was the lender whom wrote off any losses associated with repeat service or necessary review. Separate services should require separated billing. With amc’s, appraisers are essentially paying a use tax on their own services. Think of the amc fees in relationship to taxation rates. 515/215 = 42%. That’s a mighty hefty tax. Day labor and temp agencies don’t even charge that much, and unlike amc’s, labor agencies also insure the workers for their length of temporary employment. Working with an amc is like being a day laborer for life with no hope of future employment stability, and we cover all our own costs too.
The amc model in it’s current form is destined to fail, they now must adapt to more fair process and engagement terms, or suffer the consequences. The amc industry has capitalized against appraisers losses for over a decade now, and there is not much left to squeeze out. Without appraisers, amc’s can not survive. We are the final word in terms of market forces. With an ever decreasing volume of appraisers (likely to move soon from 80k current down to 40k or less with automation advents), and with an ever falling proportion of appraisers still willing to work with amc’s (25% and falling), the market has spoken. As they say, there is no greater objection than absence. Thank you.
This is ruining our profession! Most AMCs are crooks!
Hate AMC’s? Hate low fees “offered”? Declined bids? A race to the bottom for <$300 fees? STOP!!!!!!! STOP the insanity!!!! The VA has shown everyone the way. $850 per appraisal. BOTTOM fee offered. STOP taking the AMC Schit!!! Many of you are our own worse enemies. STOP desk top appraisals! STOP!!! We dig in our heals and this flips back to us. But many of you out there would rather work for the sake of working and earning peanuts. WE take all the responsibility. ALL OF IT. Why are you allowing yourselves to be robbed? A month or two of saying NO and the AMC's will sing a different tune. BTW, they did do this in Hawaii. FEES up 200%.
VA fees are going to be reduced. They actively monitor the market and will decrease it as they see fit based on appraisals submitted to other agencies and GSEs.
But they haven’t as of yet. Now have they?
They will, the chief appraiser has said as much.
But they haven’t. That is still the bottom line. Don’t you think the appraiser’s will balk at a pay cut? You’re working for the government directly, the government drags their feet on everything. I know first hand USN/Ret.
The chief appraiser does not make comptroller policy.
I believe that the comptroller is not in the decision matrix for this. The VA is not paying us directly, payment comes from the lender. That would be outside the OCC’s purview unless I am mistaken.
yup, its ridiculous I do not know how they get away with it!
When lenders requested fee surveys which appraisers were so accustomed to filling out, the lender was surveying all panel appraisers to understand what the lowest appraisal fee was, which the majority of all panel appraisers would accept. Emphasis on the majority. And that was it, the appraisal fee was formed for years at a time if not longer. All appraisers benefited except the most costly appraisers. Those whom were under the peer standard were brought up, those whom demanded more had the choice to come down or move along, and it was a straight forward simple process and honest. There was a peer standard which was not unduly influenced by the lowest priced corner cutting appraisers out there or their partner amc’s whom constantly advocate and pander for a race to the bottom in terms of fees.
What the majority of appraisers would accept. If an appraiser is good enough to be on panel, they should expect a fair share of assignments. It’s no surprise that with such little respect paid to appraisers ability to maintain operational status, appraisers consistently devalue and under prioritize amc’s. Why can’t amc’s simply distribute orders fairly in a rotational manner to all panel appraisers?
Again, a self inflicted wound. You think things are rolling along nicely, then the next appraiser ‘sets their own fees’, and you’re toast, the entire workload compromised, client relationships fizzle out and the amc says you have to compete by fee if you want continued assignments, make tough choices, cut back, and lay off the new hires. Violations of federal registry guidelines on appraiser selection based on competency and not fee but who actually follows or cares about those rules anyways. As far as sitting down to figure out solutions, people tried that, nobody listened.
https://appraisersblogs.com/appraisal/20-reasons-appraisers-should-get-paid-full-fee/
I can sell the lender on my services and attain those fair fees but what stops the amc’ from being able to represent on my behalf equally if not better? These are matters of competent agency. Why would anyone in their right mind accept an agent representative who’s sole intention is to sell you down the river and cut your income, put one in a situation ripe for future exploitation and operational instability without notice? Amc’s helped many appraisers remember or learn the hard way, we do a better job of representing ourselves.
We respect there are still a few stragglers and good people left in the amc industry but what we don’t understand is why. If you want better service, better appraisers, to grow and stop struggling or ever taking losses, just go with a simple reliable program. Go against the grain and advertise to appraisers; rotational distribution, stable reliable C&R fees which match or better the VA Panel fees. And that’s it, it’s that easy. You’ll never get past the lenders whom use amc’s though, they use amc’s to take advantage of the process, not for the betterment of the appraisal profession. Appraisers can’t get around it so many choose not to participate. Get better at sales, at representing appraisers rather than pandering to lenders. We’re all just standing by looking for better opportunities and far better representation.
Who wants to wor-erk? What is your fee and turn time? Here’s my bid: $xxx and xx/xx? AMC: DECLINED. AMC receives $800 or more for the assignment. Pay appraiser 350-400 jackpot!!!! Anyone see a problem? AMC but the appraiser made up the fee!! No you shopped around for 7-13 days robbing all the appraisers who responded of their time and resources. Make no mistake. AMC’S a/k/a – crooks.
We like that simple argument too Jaydee. It’s theft of services to constantly think it’s o.k. to drain appraisers time and resources like we’re advocates of the amc, all our time and energy constantly available to amc’s so they can shop us to infinity on a per diem assignment pattern forever to increase their own profits over our well being. They condition appraisers to become advocates of the amc or you don’t get anything. That’s not how an ethical appraiser should operate. If they returned cost savings to consumers instead of using that as a financial incentive to select the lowest priced appraiser, it would be different. But as we all know, the amc has that financial incentive because they refuse to implement rotational assignment, flat rate to appraisers, and cost plus for their own services, there is simply no way around it.
At one point during the hayday of around 2015, 2016, I was tracking my expense hours to provide amc quotes. Some days I was getting in excess of 300 fee and tat quotes every single day. I would spend approximately 2-4 hours every single day just trying to land orders, even with uncomfortably simple and brief property research like appraisers are supposed to provide. Even then I was lucky to ever work another 40 hours on actual full fee appraisal work. And when I did land orders it was always end of the line complex assignments and I forgot how nice it was to complete simple tasks like condo’s and town homes. That kind of beneficial low stress lower liability work became a distant memory after about 5 years of trying to work with amc’s, if not longer. At one point I was approved down the entire TAVMA list and beyond, as it was exceedingly easy to get approved with new amc panels, still is too. Got that chore done in a week and spent the next decade regretting it. Although I tried to seek them out, I never once ran across an amc whom had a cost plus basis. I came across a few with flat fee and rotational so they were better. But even so, the fee was always a little lower than lender direct. When I nearly got in trouble when lazy amc employees were forgetting to include counter offers, then asking me to revise and rov appraisals to cover for their mistakes, I was enough is enough, pass forever.
Funny story it had been so long since I’d applied anywhere I mistook First American for a default management company because I was tracking down this old interhinx link or something like that, a company which FirstAM had apparently bought out. I did not make the association. I filled out the application only to stare at the FirstAM vendor services agreement again like 14 years later or something which they sent to me in an email. 24 hour tat, immediate updates, penalties, non payment clauses, indemnity agreements, sterling systems records check, auto sharing of data with everyone from that network Joan Trice put together, unnecessary oversight. lol! I was like, please excuse me I thought you were a default management focused company, please erase my application and remove my numbers and such. And just like that I received a half dozen new amc panel invites. Oh darn, my mistake. I’ve quite literally spent more time asking amc’s to stop contact me than I’ve ever spent trying to work with them. And by this time all the panel invites, I don’t even bother responding. Because I keep all those records in a massive digital client file system so I track them down or review them years later. Every few years here they come again with new branding and a new pitch, but it’s the same old company whom failed every qualification metric I threw at them in the past. They’re even changing their forward facing names lately, lol. Like we’ll just retool everything and trick all the appraisers back, lol. Amc’s have become telemarketers recycling an every shrinking contact list. Shoe is on the other foot these days. I just can’t help but continue to advocate for something better for the appraiser profession. One way or another, it’s going to happen.
Places to find other work are local attorneys who need DOD Estate appraisals, Gov property tax assessment offices, State ROW work if you have the classes and experience, rural farm appraisers organizations. Another way I see appraisers getting business is take courses for teaching the Appraiser Trainee classes and start teaching the mandatory class every supervisor must take to bring in a trainee. Appraisers who become educators are at least surviving teaching. States have information on current grants for Certs who apply to train trainees. Also Google direct lenders like this page.
https://www.bankrate.com/home-equity/reviews/
Search HUDs list of approved lenders too. You can google online appraisers lists and get on them for free. Don’t join without reading the TOS for pay to play sites who just want to rob your automated payment method for fake appraisal assignments or inquiries. I had a bad experience with ThumbTack. Be careful with any other service guides requiring your CC to join so they can steal referral fees from you automatically. Some of them refuse to remove your company listing and will use your listing for their own spam or marketing purposes.
The AMC model is set up to profit the easy street. Any company that sends you an invite should be looked up online for jobs reviews or company reviews so you can avoid the bad actors. Employee reviews tell you a lot about the company management. AMC model is broken model of industry abuse & intimidation out in plain site because the mortgage industry has gone to offloading blame downstream. All (AMCs,Lenders, Banks, GSE’s, Borrowers) want is your license, signature and liability to blame and claim you harmed them. Now you CA appraisers have mortgage disclosures about Value discrepancy or bias complaints which should have had language about the correct complaint process of ROV’s and conducting peer Standard 3 reviews. The claims focus is not on getting the truth, its on getting borrowers their money back and then getting YOU out of the way. Its not focused on improving the appraisal industry its focused on a straighter line to getting $$. The industry is looking at your work to meet the minimum USPAP requirements and that YOU SIGNED for it. They dont really care because they know if there’s a complaint, YOU the appraiser are going down- then on to the next who will Play Ball for less money until they go down, –then on to the next. They keep your name on the panel but attach a profile tag ‘Do Not Use’ and never inform you as they fly under the regulation radar. Why do I know, I’ve gotten emails with Removed after my name and another email asking that I verify I was not on WellsF Do Not Use List.
Appraisers are the ones left accountable because AMC’s will settle complaints directly or with their own EO for a low fee and avoid court -why not of course.
The new PAREA program is the next band aide instead of fixing DUDD Funk with fee disclosures. I believe all appraisers fees should match what VA pays period. Why cant your state representatives agree you deserve a Reasonable and customary fee that the gubberment itself has agreed is fair. Fee manipulation intimidation is why the industry lacks appraisers. AMC’s cant exist paying decent wages and as long as the State Reps dont value your opinion or wont support you in your role nothing will change.
Straighter lines to money is get the appraisers removed from the mortgage industry and then bring in new rubber stamps appraisers for over-valuation, sellers profits and GSE’s to make more loans. The AMCs have nothing to lose supporting this model. New proposed MWaters legislation for grants to trainees is set to create an easy path for minorities but not for all races. What?? Grants to trainees funding tuition/expense as free money like hand outs that don’t need to be repaid is a offensive move to those of us who suffered greatly to get where we are. Free money to get trained is a disaster. That should be regulated assistance program as a Student Loan like every other education loan in our country. What do you think those paid off trainees will think when they are asked to push values and they got funded by the legislation passed to benefit the investors. I think that answer is clear, they will repay the favor until they get caught doing fraud or USPAP violations. PAREA is going to be Appraisal Institute wanting the education rights for profit & to stay relevant with FHA authority. A grand idea a grand solution to feed the Industry’s grinding machine just like the AMC’s are feeding the grinding machine with no care or worry. Anyone going through PAREA needs to have a special identifier attached to their license qualification and be accountable for the training they received. Today some people look at getting into appraisal just for a jobs program they can get gov funding for classes and paid living expenses which is proposed by the new legislation. The new trainees will get funded to go through the motions. They will have to be very very good test takers to pass any 7 hour state exam. PAREA program needs its own accountability on licensee complaints matching public data AQB/ASC keep track where & how they were trained.
Now Its reported 50% of all GSE loans are using AVM’s with desktops. The new cheap fee products for Desktop work using Aps to allow trainee or 3rd party inspections is just a creative way to get a insured appraiser to sign off on the report. Per Certification the appraiser is liable for ALL information provided to them the relied on to be correct and the AMC and lender laugh all the way to the bank paying you even less and charging the same fee. Be scared as hell using those unencrypted inspection aps like one called GroundWorks which discloses to you on the play store your property video or borrower owner information is uploaded sent over unencrypted communication. YIKES…..Graham Leech Bliley ACT violations for appraisers using those aps when your phone or the data gets breech and borrower gets identity theft and blames You!! Nobody cares… They just need your signature!!! The GSEs need to get out of receivership but cant because they still make too many bad loans with complicit appraisers help accepting all the liability like desperate manipulated people on a crash course with State complaints. State Complaint=No work by AMCs so you are constantly threatened with no work if you don’t play ball for a low fee and Hit that number while you state in your report you complied with AIR. Now the complaints are focused on bias or appraisal GAPS like its your fault the sale price is not supported because buyer wants to over pay, the realtors are incompetent & greedy & predatory lender wants to make any loan they can legally sell off for a profit or foreclose on.
The latest data from UAD made public in 2022 seems to show appraisers are false recipients of value complaints by GSE’s & FHFA. The AMC model wont change until rules of disclosure change and HUD fees to appraisers are mandated. You need to disclose your fee paid on top of your text addendum with the name of the AMC spelled out there in your report without fear.
Look up the rules for AMC’s in your state, most do Not require any appraiser to qualify the AMC license. Why IS that allowed by your state board, why? Any person with no appraisal license in any state can register a company in your state with no Appraiser credentials only a state registered business license. ?? Sorry but that is all wrong and AMC rules must change so that someone from their company takes a share of responsibility. Its time to start building a separate path to finding private work because to have no work or be forced to work for less than a living wage with no other way to survive will not benefit you. For a low fee $250 I think every appraiser should join NAA and write to your state legislators and those sitting on the ASC committee. What is lacking for this industry is that the major Appraisal Group players do not come out with public statements in the form of a Tweet, or a Blog supporting appraisers and their groups lack the lobby strength to make a difference.
Or, rather than retraining, rebranding, and remarketing yourself in 5 different ways you can simply move to ONE career that actually pays more than beans and gives you a forty to fifty hour work week. One example of many: web coding. HUGE demand… 4 to 6 months training.
If you’ve retired and moved on and appraising is so bad why do come back to appraisal boards?
Another area of work. Try real estate acquisition companies that purchase single family dwellings for wholesale/fix n flip. These type of companies buy single family dwellings that need work. These companies are looking for as-is and as-repaired values in a narrative format for internal purposes only before making an offer. I work directly for such a company. It’s been a very nice change of pace.
It is going to be a LEAN 2023!
Focus on other things like health… and organizing or new skills or relationships or hobbies or whatever…
I am looking to get out of the field. The suggestions are great but the income is low unless you get volume.
Cut expenses!
If Appraisers stand their ground with the AMC’s, fees can be suitable. I do a lot of work for AMC’s and I charge them more than I do for private work…and they pay it. You have to play their game, learn it, then capitalize from it and you will succeed. I refuse to do work where data has been provided by a “third party data collector”. If i’m liable, i’ll be the one measuring. Stand your ground. Earn what you deserve.
I have worked with Solidifi as a fee panel appraiser Since 2019. I was given the song and dance about $325 being the standard. I would receive orders that would show $350 wtih a sizeable portion going to the AMC. I woul decline the orders. Then the Area Manger called to say that I could ‘conditionally accept’ stating why I wanted a larger fee. I will honestly tell you that I made a good living working with Solidifi – They regularly approved the fee that I would quote. Keep in mind that I am on the Jersey Shore and many of our homes are in the millions – waterfront properties, estates etc. I was quoting $800-900 and more for complex assignments. On a few occasions, $2k-3K I was always careful to leave a portion of the fee for their margin. I got a regular flow of work and solid staff of appraisers if I needed bounce questions off of a licensed appraiser. Work right now had dwindled to virtually nothing. I have started to take listing photos for realtors – doing floorplans and virtual tours. I saw the handwriting on the wall. As far as Solidifi goes – I belive they are a really good company. The post doesn’t tell the whole story – as I said, they were always really good at approving conditional fees. Had some fees declines but was approved 99% of the time. They kept food on my table and they were pretty easy to work with.