Beware of Appraisers Point Solicitations
Appraisers, a new ‘company’ with “Appraisers Point” in their name has been marketing their services via emails across the fruited plain lately, encouraging appraisers to sign up on their web site and pay an annual fee so that ‘you’ can get on a list to be presented to, or accessed by, unnamed lenders, who might, or might not, want your service.
They have a very slick looking web site that makes them look legit.
Appraisers Point has no location shown on their website, so in reality, it could be anywhere in the world. The email messages show a location in Miami, FL. This location is a high-rise office building in downtown Miami. I called the leasing office for that building and asked if they have a tenant with the above name, or any other appraiser offices in their tower. The answer was NO.
They appear to be operating (which is in question) as a ‘portal‘… meaning they just provide a central repository of appraisers the lenders can access. Their marketing web site does not say anything about “Appraisers Point” doing anything regarding appraisal placements or after submittal report reviews. Therefore, per current policies, they technically are not an AMC. Fee payments will be from the actual lender.
When you look through their website, you’ll find a FAQ page, which has their list of suggested appraiser fees. If you think these are worthy of your experience and licensing requirements, by all means, take the bait and sign up with them! For only $48 per year, what could you lose? Well, for starters, $48! Because you really don’t know where your payment winds up.
I’ll let you surmise what I believe this marketing campaign is all about… and what you should do with the messages.
| APPRAISAL REPORT TYPE | FEE STARTS |
| 1004 – Single Family Home Appraisal | $370 |
| Single Family FHA Appraisal | $400 |
| 1007 Rent Schedule with/without 216 Operating Income | $200 |
| 1025 Duplex Appraisal | $550 |
| 1025 Fourplex Appraisal, Multi Family Investment Properties and Rentals | $550 |
| 1073 Individual Condominium Unit Appraisal | $370 |
| 2000 Single Family Field Review | $250 |
| 2000 Two- to Four-Family Field Review | $300 |
| 2055 Exterior Only (AKA Drive By) Single Family Appraisal | $250 |
| 2070 or 2075 | $120 |
| Lot Appraisal | $400 |
| Commercial Appraisals | BY QUOTE |
Dave Towne on e-AppraisersDirectory.com
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And Core Logics not the biggest snake of them all? MLS, Mapping, AMC and Mortgage. Probably own AI as well
Exactly Vincent. CoreLogic now has a monopoly, leading to appraiser extinction. Worse, many even paid them to provide data from other sporaisers, which simply strengthens their position into full AVM for lenders. They won’t need to sell software to appraisers because they will sell AVM services directly to lenders. And now the new $400K appraisal threshold approved for residential.
Appraiser Point is not the topic worthy of discussion! Anyone know how to block appraiser point texts?!!
Ken, it appears that appraisal point is not actually a bonafide company, but rather a domain name that is being offered for sale by a company called SEDO. Go to AppraisalPoint.com and you will see there is no contact address or names, no physical address, and no company history. What there is, is a link on the right side of the web site saying “this domain may be for sale’. Click the link. It IS for sale.
It appears that 2 or 3 groups have managed to get listed on their site. Perhaps for free. Perhaps not-in order to make it appear like it is a real, viable appraiser information website.
It is not.
Interesting – above was from yesterday’s research. Today it is a parked for free site on godaddy.com
appraisalpoint.com
Does anyone no how to BLOCK the Appraiser Point texts asking to join ??? I’m getting tired of deleting or ignoring, etc.
Most texts can be blocked .. these guys have figured a way around preventing block ?
I have an android phone. In upper right corner of the message are 3 dots – click it – than click option to block
Been working with Verizon on blocking them. They are definitely scam artist and not an AMC. They are masking the real location from where their email-text comes from so you can’t block them, yet, so these are sophisticated scammers, per Verizon.
They text you daily to sign up! Many appraisers are getting these texts. It is a scam. They want your $48 for nothing
Were you able to figure out how to block their texts, if received on your cell ? I have no idea how they got my information … Thanks
My phone blocks such incoming texts if I just type “STOP”.
Yes I got the text like 40 times
When they won’t tell you who they are – that’s a huge red flag!
Hell….Their fees are way too low anyway. Get ripped off for the initial fee then again if and when you get an appraisal assignment. SIGN ME UP!!!..NOT!!!
Who the hell are they to suggest any fee? Lenders and AMCs that think there is still a one size fits all fee based on forms are merely telling me that they are incompetents.
It sounds like the same as using a phone directory except you have to pay $48 to be listed? The only thing on the site, in several places, is the appraiser sign up form. There is no place for lenders to sign up or login, and I’m wondering who makes up the “national network of lenders” mentioned on their home page. I bet there are none, it has to be a scam.
But wait! There’s more! Sign up today…! 😉
Dave their fee sheet is from 2001 I assume?
The racket continues !!!
Received a call yesterday evening from a-team realty, I’m assuming they are an AMC, wanting to send me a request for an REO appraisal 50 miles 1 way for $450 and I told him $600 and he said “we pay all OUR appraisers $450”. Told him I was an independent contractor and I am not anyone’s appraiser so don’t refer to me as your appraiser. It’s good to be an old man and not give a crap anymore.
EJ! Your last sentence sums it ALL up! You are my hero!!!
I talked to my appraiser buddy the other day, he said that Corelogic was putting out the feelers to see if appraisers would be interested in doing the desktop appraisals. Muller Reports has called a few times already. FNMA has a new clip on the website that talks about reaching out to new blood to replace the old timers. In part, the new blood will be doing desk appraisals.
Exciting? If you call having high liability and working for practically nothing, than I guess bifurcated Appraisals and desktop assignments are really exciting. What a great benefit to hire people that have little or no knowledge and no license requirement and no skin in the game to be responsible to be the eyes and ears of the lender. Some times you have to take a step back in order to move forward, but this is blindfolded and off the cliff. Fannie Mae is now displaying to us who they really are, not just a threat to destroy the financial industry, but a promise to do so. They were warned time and again of poor lending practices prior to the recession and multiple other financial debacles, but keep choosing new ways to defraud the American taxpayers to bail them out time and again, and again, and again…
Fractional reserve lending, all of that.
No skin in the game.
GSE’s are the problem. Government does not solve problems, it subsidizes them.
The time to wind down the gse’s is here.
I absolutely agree with you. I feel like this is a scam to undermine how we do business, and without us being in the field, it will ultimately lead to incompetency. I don’t care how many photos are taken. I need to see the freaking neighborhood! I think as an Industry, we appraisers should object to this. It will end up in many appraisers out of a job. I’m so disgusted.
I just went to a meeting where a rep from VA, Freddie Mac, and Fannie Mae were speaking. The VA and Freddie Mac reps do not want this to go through. The Fannie Mae rep was saying take it or leave it we don’t care. It was also made very clear to all of us that when the market crashes we will be held liable. Another person said that we were only worried about our paycheck. No! I am worried about the market. I own a house. I care about how others are doing. I do not want the housing market to crash even harder this time. It makes me sick.
I then spoke to real estate agent that takes photos of homes for a mortgage company that does desktop appraisals. He said that they offer to only pay $15. Why are we going in this direction?
I also need to see the house, neighborhood, next door neighbors to see if it in great condition or dilapidated.
I predict a whole lot of desktop appraisers are going to be losing their license when all is said and done.
FNMA still doesn’t seem to grasp the fact that ‘the inspection’ of the property itself is only part of the analysis. It is not a uniformly quantifiable check the box process. Nor is the process limited to the desktop and the subject and comparables.
A huge part of the process is the drive in and around both the subject neighborhood and the comparable sales neighborhoods or competitive market area. Sounds too simple to be important, but think about it. If one does NOT know the physical boundaries then how do we know the “Big Data” market trends we pull are going to be relevant?
Mapped major roads may or may NOT identify relevant bounds. Want an example? Define the competitive market area for 16996 Mulholland Dr., Los Angeles CA using only online maps. Then tell me if you think the ‘market data’ is applicable.
You can always check the domain registration using whois https://whois.icann.org/en. This one is here: https://whois.icann.org/en/lookup?name=appraiserspoint.com. If you ever see “WhoisGuard Protected, Organization: WhoisGuard, Inc.” run. This company and the parent namecheap are the number one source for internet fraud web sites in the US. Here’s a nice story about them: https://blog.aa419.org/2017/04/18/whoisguard-a-proxy-for-crime-targeting-the-usa-from-the-usa/.
Wow! Thanks Michael!
I talked with a few people via email about this solicitation. Here are some facts;
This company uses a virtual office. They only claim a mailing address in the USA, the truth is they could be anywhere. If you don’t know about what a virtual office is, I suggest you learn immediately, it’s the new scam play to bypass brick and mortar business requirements, and simple brick and mortar business expectations.
They use an 800 number, which is the original virtual office, they could be anywhere, anywhere.
They have a protected private web address, with no clear ownership. They could be anyone. Why would a reputable business need to hide behind an anonymous wall?
They’re claiming to not be an amc, while simultaneously claiming they guarantee payments, facilitate order management, connect appraisers with lenders, and guarantee a certain predefined fee. But remember, they proclaimed they’re not an amc so you can trust them with your credit card number.
If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, and looks like a duck…
2 liter pepsi to the first person to report back they called the 800 number and identified what country they’re really in. Appraisers are easy pickings, they really are foolish enough to work with anyone without regard, really do willingly share half of their fee without resistance, and really don’t know who to or how to complain about fraud. History repeats. They sold it, and appraisers keep buying it. What’s new? My only regret is not thinking of this first.
If I cannot easily find their address in the email they sent, that’s a big red flag. If it seems to good to be true, well you know….. Years ago I tried many sites like this and for the most part they do not work. I’ve learned by trial and error they are on the whole very bad investments. I wish I still had the money I spent on many like this. If you try a site like this, you have to keep track when you receive calls and where they got your name from and if the order actually pans out to determine if your investment is worthwhile. In the last 20 years, I’ve tried at least a dozen or so and only had success with a couple.
They must have read these posts. The “suggested” fee schedule went up.
I seem to recall NAR doing the appraiser list thing a decade or so ago. It never went anywhere, even with their marketing weight.
Most likely their stated fee schedule changed because there really is no lending clients, there really is nothing other than a solicitation hook, and because they’re overseas far detached from our market realities, they missed the mark on the original solicitation.
“Adjust that fee schedule higher and try again!”
The brave new world of advanced tech is here. You’re going to love what comes next. Still loving outsourcing, automation, anonymity, virtual businesses, and the ‘global stage economy’? As a group, appraisers set themselves up for failure and they should not be surprised when the vultures circle the carcass. 40 repeat texts is just the beginning. You cellular whizzes should trace the texts and report back.
But, faster, cheaper, more volume with less effort. Just go with it. All these trusted tech companies told us it’s a more profitable approach. They would not lie, you can trust them to advocate in your best interests.
But it’s tech, so you can blindly trust it. Americans are so predictable that way.
Coester VMS fees also reportedly went up shortly before the company failed and left many appraisers unpaid. I mean, if they aren’t going to pay anyway, what’s holding fly by nights back from offering the TOP of the range?
Sort of…
“Maybe we will pay you $350”
“Maybe we will pay you $850”
“Maybe we won’t pay you”
They chose the last option with me. The SOB
Amen, Jim a contemporary and myself bid the same job, He accepted half payment down, I quoted full payment to start, he never got the other half. My old boss, “Al” taught me a bunch, some of which I had to relearn.
More ‘observations’. Nothing like advocating that appraisers unite to fight what Dave contends are low fees. So much for the free market system.
“Free market”. Joyce setting minimum wages has long been an accepted element of our economic system. Below certain amounts, it has been proven time and again, that human rights abuses follow completely unregulated employment.
Banks and AMCs have colluded for years to suppress C&R fees mandated under Dodd-Frank. On that, there is no doubt. Even Coester’s old ads from 2015+- bragged about one size fits all national appraisal fees.
Mike, minimum wage is set by the government and is exactly why it’s not a violation of ‘free trade’. It’s a federal exception. What many appraisers advocate as encouraging or trying to herd appraisers into collectively rejecting certain fees is potentially crossing the very thin line to engage in the exact practice they’re protesting against. Do you really think it was coincidence that so many AMC’s were blasting out appraisal orders at the same $290 fee several years ago? To fight this battle by invoking the same practices the AMC’s use has proven for years to be beyond ineffective. Every time this topic comes up, there is a high percentage of appraisers who snicker and go after the low fees for the volume, then go on these forums and other social media and brag about the 60, 80+ appraisals they singularly do in a month when we know it’s about a production mill that breaches the threshold of ‘data input’. They get the work because of the low fee and knowing so many appraisers are handing this additional business to them. The problem is not the AMC’s or lenders as much as it is the bottom feeder appraisers who sell each other out. You can’t lower the bar for education and experience and then stand around and wonder why the morality and business ethics followed suit.
Joyce, an appraisers ‘minimum wage’ is also mandated by the federal government “Reasonable and Customary” The intent was to allow regional markets to dictate based on real-world competition but AMCs and REVAA forced rates down far below ‘reasonable’ to assure quality and no improper shortcutting.
The 80 a month we hear about is a direct result of AMC influence; substandard reports and in exceptionally rare cases highly efficient appraiser support teams of multiple people.
Educational standards have never been lowered, Joyce [considering the 1991 standards-not the later 4-year degree standards]. They were raised far beyond what they needed to be to emulate AI and other elitist organizations. What WAS lowered is experience requirements.
If education were protection against low ethics then USC & other formerly famous universities would not be accepting bribes to admit unqualified/lesser qualified students.
Joyce, you and I see ethics issues in chat all the time. Egregious quality reports reported, but then the “Don’t snitch” mentality raises its head as if we were all out on some playground somewhere instead of defending the integrity of our profession. Lenders are greedy and create bottom feeders; AMCs (& I mean the big boys) have always sought lower prices to increase quarterly profits. LSI/Black Knight was bad enough; Ocwen outdid them; and now CoreLamode is so huge they don’t even have to consider whether what they do is legal or not; let alone moral.
Humans are products of our environment. When cheating is commonplace; or turning a blind eye is expected then morality has trouble rising above it all.
I like your posts Joyce. Don’t always agree, but you always make me think.
They should make it against the law for an AMC or lender to forbid the appraiser to copyright his or her work. If we could, that would end the data mining of our intellectual property (ie. our appraisal reports).
Mike, this is why there is a huge difference between ‘intent’ vs. reality. We all know the players and how they totally manipulated and drove down appraiser fees AND THAT INCLUDES APPRAISERS THEMSELVES. Educational standards both for state certification and the AI for their residential designations – not to mention those other bought and paid for designations, have been lowered, and yes, the college degree MATTERED. Your post validates what I’ve been saying for years. I’m beyond thankful I’m at retirement age. I’ve been fighting this battle for 35 years and while my spirit has not surrendered, at some point you have realize that the war has been lost. I retain a small glimmer of hope for Steve Cannon and the State of Louisiana case. IMO, that is the ONLY sliver of hope we have. All these meetings of all these organizations, blah, blah, blah are nothing but condescending efforts to make appraisers think they’ve contributed to the process when we all know, nothing could be further from the truth. Factor in the appraisers themselves–they can’t agree on anything. It’s like herding cats. The appraisal industry did it to themselves and it started with we departed from NAR and not getting involved and demanding FAIR representation from the AI. Not to mention when the Society surrendering to the AI. To encourage appraisers to collude not to accept fees is NOT the answer. It’s NEVER going to happen so the two wrongs justify the end game is ridiculous. Just my ‘observation’.
Eric, you surrender your copyright every time you sign up with an AMC, lender, Fannie/Freddie, or any other portal. It already is illegal to copyright without permission, however, since just about every appraiser doesn’t read the small print, they are giving their permission. That battle over copyright was tried over 10 years ago and myself and few other appraisers gave it up because we couldn’t get the masses of appraisers to understand what they were doing to themselves in the future.
Welcome to the future.
If you do a WhoIs lookup of the domain name, the actual owner’s name is privatized by a WhoIs Guard. That immediately sends up flags for me. But, the network itself, is registered to GoldenStar Business Consulting, whoever that is. Sounds like a front. Guarantee this is 100% scam, no orders will ever come out of it. The network that runs the domain….its very strange. Typically you’ll see Go Daddy or some other company that you’ve potentially heard of. Not here. Check out the who is dossier below. Smells like a scam to me:
Address lookup
canonical name appraiserspoint.com.
aliases
addresses 184.164.134.100
Domain Whois record
Queried whois.internic.net with “dom appraiserspoint.com”…
Domain Name: APPRAISERSPOINT.COM
Registry Domain ID: 2364400055_DOMAIN_COM-VRSN
Registrar WHOIS Server: whois.namecheap.com
Registrar URL: http://www.namecheap.com
Updated Date: 2019-04-24T01:00:53Z
Creation Date: 2019-02-26T21:21:36Z
Registry Expiry Date: 2021-02-26T21:21:36Z
Registrar: NameCheap, Inc.
Registrar IANA ID: 1068
Registrar Abuse Contact Email: abuse@namecheap.com
Registrar Abuse Contact Phone: +1.6613102107
Domain Status: clientTransferProhibited https://icann.org/epp#clientTransferProhibited
Name Server: NS1.APPRAISERSPOINTSERVER.COM
Name Server: NS2.APPRAISERSPOINTSERVER.COM
DNSSEC: unsigned
URL of the ICANN Whois Inaccuracy Complaint Form: https://www.icann.org/wicf/
>>> Last update of whois database: 2019-05-18T04:38:19Z <<>> Last update of WHOIS database: 2019-05-17T14:38:26.76Z <<<
Network Whois record
Queried rwhois.securedservers.com with "184.164.134.100"…
%rwhois V-1.0,V-1.5:00090h:00 portal.securedservers.com (Ubersmith RWhois Server V-3.1.10)
autharea=184.164.128.0/19
xautharea=184.164.128.0/19
network:Class-Name:network
network:Auth-Area:184.164.128.0/19
network:ID:NET-104545.184.164.134.96/29
network:Network-Name:Public
network:IP-Network:184.164.134.96/29
network:IP-Network-Block:184.164.134.96 – 184.164.134.103
network:Org-Name:GoldenStarBusinessConsulting
network:Street-Address:9528 Miramar Rd
network:City:San Diego
network:State:CA
network:Postal-Code:92126
network:Country-Code:US
network:Tech-Contact:MAINT-104545.184.164.134.96/29
network:Created:20190212223409000
network:Updated:20190212223409000
network:Updated-By:dnsadmin@securedservers.com
contact:POC-Name:DNS Administrator
contact:POC-Email:dnsadmin@securedservers.com
contact:POC-Phone:(480) 422-2023
contact:Tech-Name:DNS Administrator
contact:Tech-Email:dnsadmin@securedservers.com
contact:Tech-Phone:(480) 422-2023
contact:Abuse-Name:Abuse
contact:Abuse-Email:abuse@securedservers.com
contact:Abuse-Phone:+1-480-422-2022 (Office)
%ok
Queried whois.arin.net with "n 184.164.134.100"…
NetRange: 184.164.128.0 – 184.164.159.255
CIDR: 184.164.128.0/19
NetName: SS5
NetHandle: NET-184-164-128-0-1
Parent: NET184 (NET-184-0-0-0-0)
NetType: Direct Allocation
OriginAS: AS32164, AS20454
Organization: SECURED SERVERS LLC (SSL-65)
RegDate: 2011-05-13
Updated: 2011-05-13
Ref: https://rdap.arin.net/registry/ip/184.164.128.0
OrgName: SECURED SERVERS LLC
OrgId: SSL-65
Address: 2353 W University Bldg A
City: Tempe
StateProv: AZ
PostalCode: 85281
Country: US
RegDate: 2003-12-08
Updated: 2018-06-27
Ref: https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/SSL-65
ReferralServer: rwhois://rwhois.securedservers.com:4321
OrgTechHandle: IPADM294-ARIN
OrgTechName: IPADMIN
OrgTechPhone: +1-480-422-2031
OrgTechEmail: ipadmin@phoenixnap.com
OrgTechRef: https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/IPADM294-ARIN
OrgAbuseHandle: ABUSE1536-ARIN
OrgAbuseName: Abuse
OrgAbusePhone: +1-480-422-2022
OrgAbuseEmail: abuse@phoenixnap.com
OrgAbuseRef: https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/ABUSE1536-ARIN
I actually paid the fee to see what this was all about. Have I heard anything? NO. Orders? NO. Nothing. So now that leaves me with the same option I had when Coester hacked my email accounts. I’m going after them. If you just do what’s right good comes from it. I stayed my ground with Coester and pushed him to the limit. How did that turn out for him? Well it’s about to happen again. Not sure why many more don’t take action instead of just sitting here waiting.
Their 800 number is also listed on this site for some kind of coffee franchise. Click on contact us.
https://www.franchisegator.com/licenses/rm-coffee/
In Florida any mediation between appraisal services and clients is appraisal management. Should probably let the Florida Real Estate Appraisal Board know.
I’m betting they are an overseas scam though…
Mark, I bought into and now I a bit upset. Let me know how I can help to go after these kind of crooks.
Send me an email. Markskapapp@gmail.com
Just got my first text message soliciting my business Thanks for the post.
I also received a text from them, I just press delete.
Blocked! Thanks everyone for the input.
Let’s hear from one person who actually got an order, completed it and actually got paid
I think I took the bait and got scammed. Has anyone actually talked to anyone at there location or better yet received the money back after 30 days?
Friends, never send anyone money for an AMC list placement. Period. If you are gambling that it could be a new source of work, fine, but do it cautiously. Make sure they are registered as an AMC with your state first. If they are not, then turn them in!
This company has had enough doubt raised about it for so long now, none of us should be trusting them. I get that Mark and a few others tested the waters, but now its time to get these (& all unlicensed-unregistered AMC) fraudsters shut down.
I agree Mike. I did this as a sort of a public service to see what it was all about and if it was legit. Apparently its not. Now this is something that needs to be looked into and i need to start digging like I have before in my lawsuit.
Absolutely agree Mark. At best, these guys are a new software designer driven interlope into an area they know nothing about. At worst it’s just what we think it may be. An offshore effort to circumvent U.S. & State Laws. Let me know how I can help. Email.
Could be worse. Could be Brian Coester and a new company. I mean who knows.
Their FAQs says they will refund your money if you aren’t happy. I wonder how that is working out. It also looks like they increased their fees.
Am I guaranteed a certain number of appraisals a month?
Unfortunately, we cannot predict how many orders you will get as it depends on your location. However, we offer 30 days 100% No Questions Asked Money-Back Guarantee. If for any reason you are not satisfied with our services, we will refund 100% of your money.
Yep, no questions asked…..just a visit to their physical office and will get a refund after a couple of butt whippings!!
Thank you for the warning… just unsubscribed after two texts
Today I received two texts of which I have received about 5 in total over the last 3 months, but today I have been doing such a good job that there was a deposit of $15,000, I just need to check it out!! Scam written all over it.
The latest on this is now they are going to stop taking new appraisers on as of 08/01/2019 as they are at capacity, so hurry up and send in your money before August 1st because after that date the registration list is closed!!! RIGHT!!! guarantee if I wanted to sign up and waste my money on August 10th they would be more than willing to take my money
A reputable AMC (whatever that may be) would NEVER require money to sign up with them. Think about it. They charge the borrowers and take a disproportionately large part of the fee to begin with. Their business model depends on that. People whose business model relies on paying a fee to (at best) be given less than C&R fees are predators that should be driven from the business.
Full circle with the snake oil salesman again people.
Scam or not, clearly paying for orders in this industry is a red flag to me. Paying after, for the marketing part, maybe OK. But a fee upfront for the right to MAYBE get orders? No chance. The thing that upsets me is that I do not mind marketing emails, calls or whatever, but when I say no, that’s enough. I have sent the word “stop” to the text messages, nothing. I have sent stop emails to the email address, nothing That would put this on a scam level to me, is when they are not keeping track of their “Yes’s” and “No’s”, it is just a blanket solicitation with the hope of getting your credit card information.
I’m getting relentless text messages from Appraisal Point and don’t know how to get rid of them! I send back threatening messages telling them I will relay this to the State RE Commission but that doesn’t seem to deter them. Any suggestions?
Don’t stop at threatening to turn them in. Turn them in for license verification and harassment. If they aren’t licensed in your state, turn them in to District Attorney or County Prosecutor’s Office.