CA Appraisers 50% Decline & Fees Up 76%

Number of CA Appraisers Drop 50 percent & Renewal Fees Up 76 percentThe Number of CA appraisers drops from 20,120 to 9,987. Renewal fees up 76% for 2020.

Excerpt: It’s time to assess and reflect on the numbers as the decade ends. It’s noteworthy that the total population of Bureau of Real Estate Appraisers (BREA) licensees has now fallen below 10,000 for the first time since the Bureau began keeping records. The numbers reflect some interesting trends.

Licensee population counts vary daily as licenses are granted and others expire, so this data is a recent snapshot in time. Also, approximately 7% of licensees are trainees, 8% report out-of-state addresses, and some percent are not actively practicing. Therefore, it’s likely that the number of active working appraisers in California is somewhere around 8,000.

More surprising are the numbers that show how the population of appraisers in California is aging and how few young people are entering the profession. Nearly 70% of licensees are over 50, almost 40% are over 60, and less than 12% are under 40. When trainees are removed from the count, there are more licensees from ages 80–89 (109) than there are from ages 20–29 (88).

My comments: Of course, as we all know, first FHA required certified appraisers, then AMCs did, even though some of their lender clients did not. Who is going to keep trainees for the years required to become certified plus have a few years experience after being certified? Plus, inspect with them. Very few appraisers will do this. I would have not hired trainees in my business if this was required.

Lowering licensing requirements won’t help if there is no one to train appraisers.

CA is on a 4 year full CE cycle. Every 2 years USPAP is required. Every 4 years all CE is required. The annual renewal fee for certified is $462.5 starting 1/1/20. In 2019 it was $262.50, an increase of 76%. In 2006 it was $150. In 1994 it was $202.50.

What will this mean? As more appraisers retire or quit and give up their licenses, there will be more work for the appraisers that are left. Many baby boomers, including myself, are cutting back on appraisal work, making it harder to justify the fixed costs, including licensing and CE.

To read more and see tables and graphs, click here.

My comment: CA is useful for comparison as it has a large number of appraisers in a wide geographic area.

NOTE: To subscribe to Appraisal Today monthly newsletter click here.

Ann O'Rourke
Latest posts by Ann O'Rourke (see all)
Image credit flickr - Payton Chung
Ann O'Rourke

Ann O'Rourke

Ann O'Rourke, MAI, SRA, MBA, is the publisher and editor of Appraisal Today newsletter and practicing fee appraiser for 40 years (commercial and residential) in Alameda California. Click here to subscribe to her newsletters.

You may also like...

45 Responses

  1. Wyatt Powell on facebook Wyatt Powell on facebook says:

    I wonder what percentage of that was not really working to begin with and decided it wasn’t worth renewing with such large fees. As with every profession, many just keep a license on the back burner.

  2. Vincent Simon on Facebook Vincent Simon on Facebook says:


  3. Joe Lograsso on Facebook Joe Lograsso on Facebook says:

    Apparently still too many since the fees are so low.

  4. Avatar Cotton says:

    The amcs still offer less than 400 per appraisal in LA. as i type this I just received a rush 1004 on a 2.2 million dollar property with a fee of $375. You cant pay your bills at that fee. If there is a shortage of appraisers the AMC fees would clearly be much higher. Based on my conversations with appraisers the bifurcation crap and below market appraisal fees has pushed many appraisers out of the business. What sense does it make to bring any new blood into a business where the AMCs already rob the appraiser/consumer of over 50% of the appraisal fee. Much better ways to make money than to tolerate the failed AMC business model. I personally have multiple steams of income. I can leave this business at a moments notice. The appraiser shortage problem can only be solved by paying reasonable and customary fees and The removal of the AMCs.

    • Avatar Bill Johnson says:

      I get it Cotton. Have you heard the one about the appraiser who worked 60 hours a week and pulled in $75,000 a year while living like a king in a low cost of living area? That $75,000 to you (LA) and me (SD), lives more like $45,000 where 100% of it would go to rent in a terrible neighborhood with an even worse school district.

      Seek the truth, tell the truth, and ignore others who don’t want to believe you while saying you complain to much.

    • Avatar CA Appraiser says:

      Yet Clear Capital charges the lender $855 for that rush appraisal and they take 56% of the fee…. no thanks

    • Avatar James Pratt says:

      Appraisers can change this in a week. Don’t take any orders for less than $600 or what ever you feel your time and effort are worth.

      AMCs will cry but Lenders will accept the fees as they NEED us.

      My lowest fee this year has been $600, my average FHA Fee to this point is $713 for a 1004 and $667 for a 2055.


      A quick look over my books for this year show the following
      $675 – 1004C FHA
      $775 – 1004 FHA
      $700 – 1004
      $1,200 – 1004 (Rural)
      $850 – 1004
      $850 – 1025
      $700 – 1004C

      As you can see, there is no reason to take orders from CHEAP AMCs

      • My hero today! Thank you for posting.

        Im currently basing my fees on both an hourly rate and complexity of the assignment. I MAY do easy transactional work for an equivalent rate of $100 an hour but since house painters and auto mechanics raised their fees well above that, I bumped my non-expert witness fees to $150 an hour.

        EW fees are still at $500 an hour. I LIKE that we are sharing our customary and reasonable fee information for various service levels. We also need to share the rates bid by AMCs.

        I saw one recently where trip fees were calculated at $20 an hour plus $0.58 a mile! $20 an hour? I didn’t pay trainees that little back in 2000! My point on this last one is that when AMCs are claiming we need to discount our desktops, drivebys etc for purported time we save (we don’t actually save any time if doing we do these correctly). THEN they want us to discount fees by $100 to $250! Our hourly rate if being discounted is four to ten times higher than what they perceive our time is worth they seek bids.

        Keep posting this kind of data. It is NOT a violation of Sherman Anti Trust as long as we are not telling everyone else to charge the same amount. I would never do that. I MAY suggest they are damned fools if they don’t charge a sensible rate though.

  5. Avatar Bill Johnson says:

    As a CA appraiser (San Diego), I’ve been spreading the truth on this site for years, so if your keeping up on your required reading, this is old news. Don’t get me started on adjusting for cost of living where say a big city in Idaho is +/- 40% cheaper to live in compared to my city. Across the board client/AMC national appraisal fees / preset TRID requirements. Sorry, but some appraisers nationally can live like kings at $400 a pop, while the same fee in high population appraisal centers (CA / cost of living) lives more like $240.

    This is not a hijacking of the topic, but California is leading the crash of the entire appraisal profession (having 1 in 8 of every appraiser), and in spreading the CA truth for years, many have attempted to shoot the messenger versus understanding the reality.

    Lastly, with on average stagnating to decreasing CA appraisal fees (80% of volume now via AMC / past 20 years), and with a 50% reduction of supply (appraisers), who here thinks the future solution will be to double the fees to attract new blood? Over the next decade, CA will be the proving ground of the industry as to why appraisers are the problem (get rid of them), versus enacting solutions detailed and dating back to the petition of 2009 (HVCC).

    Seek the truth.

  6. Avatar SB says:

    Funny how BREA sent this announcement to California Appraisers on XMAS eve. when they thought nobody was paying attention.

    Total pay & benefits
    James S Martin BUREAU CHIEF, BUREAU OF REAL ESTATE APPRAISERS, DEPARTMENT OF CONSUMER AFFAIRS State of California $189,212. EVERY year he gets his pay increased while the California Appraiser counts plummet. Salary was $145,784 in 2013.

    The only profitable endeavor remaining in our industry is to become an INVESTIGATOR.

    • Avatar Bill Johnson says:

      An investigator, who with a change in CA state law, now can’t investigate (APPRAISE / REVIEW) to check one’s work for true violations.

      Seek the truth, and here’s to Bill crushing Rita.

      • Along those lines, BREA is NOW trying to get even more money for higher salaries and only hire general certified appraisers on the mistaken premise that they can handle all complaint property types.

        In my 2017 court case, Sr. Investigator John Schmidt said that he had done ‘about’ 500 review appraisals in his 18-year career with BREA. Keep in mind that not one of those was for an outside organization; a lender, FNMA, VA, FHA, pvt practice or ANY other market participants. In all his entire career he had never performed an appraisal using UAD formats or collateral underwriter rated property. He did not know the difference between an SFR and a commercial condominium. NOW BREA wants to offer even more money for people like him. Circa 2015 his SALARY and BENEFITS via BREA was in excess of $105,000. [ scroll down to blue linked grid showing each BREA employee salary; overtime and benefits package cost back when the report was prepared ]

        500 appraisals in 18 years = 27 a year or only 2.3 per month on average. Any appraiser readers earning an average SALARY of $3,889 per report for only 2.3 per month? In a job its next to impossible to be fired from? Without having to keep current on (by actual practice) on current trends and practices?

        So now the head of BREA wants to offer MUCH more, in order to have this same level of expertise on hand but NOT ALLOW them to do USPAP compliant appraisal reviews?

        The reason BREA fines and fees are so high now is that BREA is broke.(It’s not hard to see why considering the extremely low production capacity of their staff). Its been bad for years, but they have finally ended the pretense of performing USPAP compliant appraisal reviews.

        Instead, they will become “fact finders”. I’m still looking into USPAP to see where the metric of report compliance was changed from being recognized as NOT BEING A FACT TO BE FOUND, but only (subjectively) what would be (vaguely) acceptable to users, and their peers.

        Imagine, BREA will not have one single peer on staff to review the appraiser’s work.

        AARO has succeeded in destroying the Public Trust in California. Now they will be coming to states near you! (BREA’s current Commissioner is a former officer of director of AARO)-the group that circumvents state legislatures to effect changes in the law.

        it’s not enough to complain here. Appraisers need to write to the California State Auditors Office [ ] and point out how they are violating USPAP; Violating State law which requires that ALL appraisers comply with USPAP and their job descriptions still fit the definition of an appraisal despite their sophistry to the contrary.

        Then, of course, there is a violation of public trust by undermining the foundations of fairness that every single licensed, or certified appraiser mistakenly thought they were entitled to. A simple USPAP compliant (SR3/4 appraisal review of our own work subject to the same standards we are being measured against).

        • Baggins Baggins says:

          If I was caught up in a scenario like that it would seem prudent to show up in front of the board with a series of independently and double blind ordered reviews of my own work. The expense may be nominal compared to the possible implications of fine and loss of work with a complaint hanging to you for life, and the ethically compliant reviews would be good evidentiary points if for nothing else than logical contrast.

          These are the basics of valuation service which ce constantly drills home, the scope of work does have a strong potential to effect assignment results and the developing appraiser is the sole person in charge of scope of work to achieve credible assignment results. It is simply not logical to apply a varied scope of review compared to development and presume a credible review result is achieved. As I mentioned previously, state reviewers should perhaps have to pass testing which proves competency in the arts such as va, fnma, fha, independent, farm, land, lease, investment, special state programs, and legalese understanding in dynamic scenarios.

          Really know nothing about CA other than what I’ve read here but it sounds like a departure from expected expectations of due process. In appraisal review, considering scope of work for the developing appraiser is the foundation of forming an acceptable and fair scope of work for the review process. Otherwise based on a reviewers possible bias, review scope could be crafted to slap anyone down with fines.

          I appreciate your posts Mr Ford, always thought provoking and informative.

      • Avatar Fred Broke AssASkunk Schwartz says:

        I can’t read anymore of this. It’s beyond disturbing as it is clear none of our voices are heard, certainly not by Washington or obviously the BREA here in California. I’ve been a CA residential appraiser for 32 years now. 32 years…In a row! Everyday rain or shine…out there on the front line…I work tirelessly each day, just as I did way back then in 1987, when my standard fee was….wait for it…$300..yep, the same today as it was back in 1987! $300 Freegin Bucks!

        For god sake, when will this nightmare end! I can barely make a living today with 1/2 of the fee going to the AMC, let alone complete at best two reports a day if i’m lucky given all the bullshit we have to cover our ass with to satisfy all the players n powers that be. Before the AMC’s rode into town, I was able to enjoy a good living, support my family, own a home, have a semblance of a decent life. Today…ha! I struggle each month just to feed myself! Let alone make rent, take something of a vacation or even a xmas.forget it..I can barely afford to put gas in my car most days…..Its a joke what’s going on and if I could I..I swear to God I would leave this awful profession for good, but I’m stuck.. i’m a slave to this mess of a once promising enjoyable career Im a whore…a slave to the AMCs, stressed out of my mind ..every day…dealing with AMCs…emails of their constant daily solicitations, propositions, grinding conditions, and lovely 30 day payment terms…I work/live each day in fear…its constant stress…i’m just surviving barely…just trying to keep up, stay above water…under daily pressure…who can do it the cheapest…turn the appraisal back in the fastest…it’s worse than before..way worse…I want out…but what can I do…we need to appease them or we go hungry…hello! and you wonder why the pool of appraisers is shrinking!

        Get a clue Washington…Look at what a mess of a once respected, desired profession u created!!! Thanks….

        • One of the most candidly accurate depictions of a typical highly experienced California appraiser I’ve read recently. Fred started half a year after I did. Back then $300 was about 10% above the average, meaning that his clients had to like his work to be willing to pay that much (same amount my mentor charged). Back then our work was field reviewed. Perhaps 1-10 to 1-20. It predated licensing, but we all were “class” I (limited exp-sfr & condo) ; II-SFR,condo and 2-4 units. Class III All the foregoing plus apartments in excess of 4 units and Class IV C&I.

          With extremely few exceptions we were always paid on or before the appraisal appointment. An appraisal for which comps had been pulled the day before could be inspected at 08:30 and written up in pencil by noon for review and typing. Leaving the afternoon free to review prior typing corrections; questions, revisions (fairly rare), and new research for the following days work. Boilerplate was literally cut and paste since none of us used computers in ’87 for forms.

        • Avatar Bill Johnson says:

          Permission to quote you word for word Fred?

          Seek the truth.

        • Avatar Scott says:

          I’m with you, Fred. I started as an apprentice in 1982. My fee split was only slightly less than some of these fees I see today. Two years with Far West Savings Appraisal Dept in the mid-’80s provided an annual salary of $50k which included all data sources, office space, mileage reimbursement, and full benefits. Been working as a sole proprietor ever since and made an awesome living until 2008. Past AMC models (before they were ‘mandated’) was okay; however, the current AMC model is a disaster and has ruined my beloved profession and much needed and much earned income. Of course, I am still on the treadmill chasing the carrot engaging with as many non-AMC client’s as possible every day just to make ends meet. Or not!.

          • Baggins Baggins says:

            The nightmare ends when appraisers quit enabling the process and instead market to lenders directly, refusing all amc work.

            Appraisers are providing a thing of value to the amc’s by simply accepting the requests. It should not be surprising that as long as the financial incentive remains, the business model will not change.

            We all would like complete industry corrections. That seems to be an impossible task as long as providing a thing of value to be the preferred appraisal order assignee remains a legal option.

            You can escape the nightmare individually by simply engaging in dedicated marketing and contacting lenders directly down the line, finding out whom abuses appraisers with use of amc’s, and whom does not. Sign up where you can, continue marketing, repeat until you have a fair amount of direct assignment work.

            Many appraisers I’ve spoken to in person are surprised to find out those same lenders they see posted on amc orders also have a body of direct assignment work and direct panels. The deal is if they learn or know you are willing to work for amc’s, you’re far less likely to get accepted on those panels for consistently higher fee work. That and you really have to bring it with quality detailed work product and have a good ability to get the job done without supervision, can’t use their review services as a stop gap and just turn in reports fast and furious, have to proof read ahead of time. The enticement to use typing services, runners, auto programs, that all falls by the way side when you’re dealing with the heightened requirements of direct panels.

            Sharing the appraisal fee is for the birds.

  7. Avatar ej says:

    The AMCs have started 2020 with a bang. Solidifi is sending out orders with a **three-day*** turnaround time (including weekends). Pro-Teck is blasting 1004 orders for $290.00. Where are the regulators!

    • Baggins Baggins says:

      The government’s purpose is not to save you from yourself.

      You asked for it by signing up with those companies, and you got it.

      Standard safeguards include a company having a standard base fee you can rely on which is acceptable for you. I was getting 650’s regular during the rush and am now regrettably back down to the 500-550 per range. I take the good with the bad and avoid bidding. tat’s vary per client, the good ones have 2 weeks standard, sometimes 1 if the deal is heated, others go 1 week standard but are open to negotiation.

      Although mercury allows fee entry, staying on the high side will help assure you won’t leave money on the table and then your reliable direct assignment clients will just send you at the number slightly lower than your fee and it’s all good. The big mistake is pandering to discount clients because then direct assignment people won’t even add you to panel because they’ll know you’re probably cutting corners to provide such a superficially lower fee. The 1 dollar for all products fee entry is a viable alternative but as your profile then auto populates at the top for all the slimebag amc’s whom use standard search by fee features within assignment systems, you get a lot of amc harassment. I went with higher side but still validated C&R fees from older workingre mag fees instead.

      Not asking for the lions share of orders, but instead inquiring if there is a fairly balanced workload assignment trend are effective marketing strategies. If an appraiser tries to compete by fee within quality direct assignment panels, they become an instant red herring.

      Appraisers are tasked with analyzing deals which are put together by some of the most successful and often most cunning salesmen in this country, realty agents. If appraisers can’t skip past the jr ameture hour sales crowd which populates the majority of amc houses, they really have no business trying to stick around in this industry.

      Look left. Look right. Identify the fish. If you can’t, the fish is you.

      First one to say a number loses.

      ABC. Always be closing. I want those glen gary glen ross leads!

  8. Baggins Baggins says:

    Fee comments above. The real problem is the financial incentive for amc’s to drive down appraisers fees for variable opportunistic unearned fee raking, lack of appropriately separated appraisal and amc service fees. The potential and cash is available for appraisers to hire. Amc’s get to the money first and they hire instead.

    It is no coincidence that amc’s boast record setting growth as appraiser income and populace numbers fall. There is a direct relationship to the unearned fee raking of the appraisal fee by the amc, and the reduced incentive and financial ability of appraisers to train others.

    Just today talking to an upcoming really bright young realtor lady. Cluing her in on the appraisal side. She says, do you work for this specific major lender, that might make a good lead, she had just represented a buyer and they charged that buyer over a thousand dollar for the appraisal services fee.

    I then explained how the big box lenders whom use amc’s have a certain fix in place. The game being to drive up consumer fees on a fixed fee basis, then force the appraiser to go through an amc. The amc tells appraisers they allow the appraiser to set their own fee. The amc profits from the fee differences and does not return cost savings to consumers. The appraiser whom has the lowest fee and provides the most thing of value to the amc gets the first place majority workload of all assignments. Forcing appraisers at each others throats like dog eat dog, promoting the pursuit of operational shortcuts and outsourcing opportunities at every possible step.

    It is somewhat entertaining and gratifying to listen to peoples reactions to such an obvious conflict of interest and blatantly unethical assignment system. Can you imagine if amc’s could be in charge of placing listings with realty agents under similar terms? RLPMC’s, on the horizon. Realtor listing placement management services. All they need is a separation of interest rule between a licensed salesperson and a homeowner whom seeks to sell and they will be in business. Lowest list fee gets it, cost savings from reduced listing fees will not be returned to the seller. I would not recommend the appraisal industry as a career to anyone until the amc issue is resolved and they are forced at a minimum, to bill separately.

    The Orourke publication sounds like it’s better than ever and still going strong. I wonder how many individual amc workers bother to subscribe.

    • Avatar Bill Johnson says:

      Yep, takes me an hour+ for the inspection, and 30 minutes to educate the borrowers and or agents regarding the game of appraising. Although there are thousands of agents in my county, not a month goes by where an agent doesn’t recognize and remember a past appraiser education session (in person, and or via agent comp sale interview).

      True story, I spent 20 minutes yesterday helping a veteran (VA assignment) unload her truck while conducting a 1004D. When others are on time crunches pushing out 4 to 9 appraisals a day, I’m not afraid to put people ahead of profit, nor the message / education in front of my time.

      Seek the truth.

  9. Avatar Susan L says:

    Great article and comments, but I just checked the CA license renewal fees and it is over $1,000 for an on-time Certified Residential renewal! That’s every 2 years, plus the at least $1,000 of CE required in the “full CE” every other renewal. Secondly, USPAP is incorporated into the CA laws governing appraisers, seems to me that Bureau investigators should be required to maintain full licensing/ education requirements themselves. I thought the regulation change was just that investigators couldn’t maintain an outside appraisal practice, not that they shouldn’t be licensed.

    • You make an excellent point. “THE” point in fact. Prior to January 2019, ALL licensed, or certified appraisers in the state of California had to follow USPAP. There were no exceptions for BREA. As for CE and fees most CA governmental agencies PAY license fees required for jobs of state employees.

      Since we proved in court in June/July 2017 that BREA rarely follows USPAP, and in fact mostly was unaware of fundamental appraisal practices that would be required to be peers, BREA took another tact. Instead of upping their skills, they decided to employ ridiculous sophistry and pretend that the appraisal reviews they did and still do, are not appraisal review at all, but “findings of facts”.

      Previously, to avoid a potential conflict of interest the law read (basically) that No California appraisers employed by BREA shall perform any appraisals or review appraisals EXCEPT IN THE PERFORMANCE OF THEIR DUTIES AT BREA.” It only meant they could not take outside work.

      In January 2019 they had the law changed to read simply that “No California appraiser employed by BREA may perform appraisals or appraisal reviews.”

      HUGE DIFFERENCE! It’s in keeping with their pretense that they are merely fact finders and not doing appraisal reviews anymore. Of course, their just-released December 2019 Bureau Revision plans show they want to replace all lower-level licensed appraiser and res cert appraisers with AGs so that the AGs can investigate any level of property appraisal. It’s an odd requirement since they no longer pretend to be required to comply with USPAP and by extension FIRREA. AGs are quite often not very good at doing SFR or 2-4 unit appraisals. The ones at BREA must be even worse than the norm since THEY haven’t actually even done ANY sfr or 2-4 unit appraisals in 20+ years! No senior appraiser at BREA has EVER done a FNMA CU rated, UAD reported appraisal. NEVER – NOT ONE.

      BREA now exists for one purpose. To generate revenue to continue being able to pay the inflated salaries of the existing and future employees of the bureau along with annual raises and in excess of $30,000 additional yearly benefits.

      Since license revenue has dropped by more than 50%, they first had to increase fines and even impose fines where no real violations occurred. Minor omissions are inflated to read like the planning and deliberate attacks of 9/11.

      Almost completely eliminated are non public warnings or simple remedial courses. Prior fines of $500-$1,500 have been “up-charged” so that fines of $5,000 to $10,000 can be imposed based on $500 for each citable offense. One oversight = 2 offenses (SR1 & SR2) PLUS competency, SOW and other Preamble related charges as fillers.

      If they disagree with rent survey then nearly 20 separate charges can be easily alleged (if rents are wrong then competency, scope , SR1/SR2 were missed; AND value conclusions are also missed so that each separate charge can now be compounded as additional charges. DOUBLE that if TWO rent comps are challenged) Triple it for three, and so on. Obviously wrong rents in the eyes of NON-REVIEWING BREA employees also means the report is ‘factually’ misleading….For each charge. Finding 20-25 reasons for non compliance becomes easy. All arising from a single fundamental dispute.

      I’m personally curious to see how they will support contentions that forecast rents are “factually wrong” now that they do no appraisal reviewing. (The nature of instances & typical allegations are composites from actual cases BREA has taken to Admin Law Court).

      Documented perjury is also not outside their routine. Multiple witnesses testified that John Schmidt, Sr, BREA Real Property Appraiser/Investigator made multiple statements to suppress due process (paraphrased) which he denied making. Three witnesses. Two testified and BREA declined to call the 3rd who had been told the same misinformation by Schmidt.

  10. Avatar Thom says:

    The “Opportunity Costs” for a practicing Appraiser is indisputable, no matter where you’re from. It’s even higher if you’re in an exurban area and the AMC’s sends in the urban poachers who will perform a dis-service for both the local appraiser and their community.

  11. Avatar Chris says:

    Sit through a USPAP course and you’ll understand why no one wants to be an appraiser. Over-regulation, outdated standards, cumbersome forms to prepare, scope creep. This profession won’t improve until appraisers are given protections rather than more regulations. It’s a shame that our own people sitting on the ASB and AQB, as well as the state boards, continue to throw appraisers under the bus.

    • The very few protections appraisers were given (Dodd-Frank) & even USPAP itself (the measurement of compliance) are nearly 100% ignored by all regulatory agencies in their own analyses of our compliance.

      The worst state for fair appraiser treatment is California – hands down. BREA deceives legislators and top career and elected officials into thinking they preserve and promote public trust in appraisal while their actions do just the opposite. Many states fall short’ (meaning they do not adhere to the same standard of performance that we are required to follow.

      TAF and even ASC to some extent are responsible for this. They support and promote AARO which is a gang of state regulators pretending to undertake independent actions (for enhanced enforceability of USPAP) as a private corporation when their very existence runs contrary to the intent of most states so-called “Sunshine Laws”.

      AARO routinely usurps elected legislators responsibility and lobbies changes in law that would be prohibited by most State Employees acting in their official capacities.

      FIRREA itself has finally been fully subverted as a result.

    • Avatar Taunya says:

      I do agree USPAP is outdated.

      I’m not sure how we are over-regulated. Actually, if congress didn’t require us to be used, they wouldn’t use us. They would just use AVMs. They don’t now, because the feds won’t let them.

      USPAP does not dictate the form or the scope. That’s the lender’s and AMCs. And most of that is coming from a big-shall-not-be-named-PITA big bank. And FNMA. And now the Treasury, which has recommended eliminating appraisals.

      Our biggest threat is Congress.

      • Baggins Baggins says:

        Our biggest threat is the federal reserve system and their violation of Article 1 Section 10, coining a fiat currency.

        If the lenders were not backed by the taxpayer via gse’s and FDIC programs, attention to risk management would be heightened not diminished. aka; poisonous protectionism which incentivizes greater risk in both housing development and real property lending.

        Ethics is at its core, supposed to be a moral guideline. It is not so easily rewritten. Rewriting ethics is a reaction to a changing morality of society. How’s globalism working out for your personally?

  12. Avatar Justin M Judge says:

    Sole Prop Appraiser now seeking appraiser trainees that are able to operate as a business to business transaction. Trainee applicants must be certified level or higher in good standing and have his/her own corporation.

  13. Avatar Mountainman says:

    I spent 3.5 years working multiple jobs and appraising as a trainee. It cost a great deal of money and way more then 2000 hours once all is said and done and got paid pennies per appraisal. Once I finally got my license the pay is minimal for Southern CA and so I took a job with a lender doing private valuations and analysis. People cannot afford to get or maintain this license. The job you were hoping for really does not exist. Now I’m considering letting this license go after all of that work and sacrifice. If BREA does not get it together with common sense solutions I believe that this profession will go away. Lenders will not be able to wait for appraisals for extended periods of time when there are not enough appraisers to complete the assignments.

    • Dont look to BREA for help. They are more interested in finding fault, or when no real fault exists, in fabricating imaginary scenarios of fault (This is based on actual evidence in a specific case-not hyperbole).

      TAF made it worse by redefining the most common perceptions of the word ‘misleading’. “Mislead | Definition of Mislead by › dictionary › mislead

      Definition of mislead. transitive verb. : to lead in a wrong direction or into a mistaken action or belief often by deliberate deceit His comments were a deliberate attempt to mislead the public. intransitive verb. : to lead astray : give a wrong impression exciting as they are, they mislead— E. M. Forster”

      Originally USPAP intended to deal with this definition. Now, TAF has redefined it to be any form-intentional or not. YOU may report what is believed to be factual or credible data, BUT if BREA (or MA or MD) later learns (or merely interprets/alleges) your data to be wrong then your report is misleading and in violation of USPAP. Regardless of limiting conditions stated within the same report.

      We all need to write to GAO in follow up to Maxine Waters’ inquiries regarding whether FIRREA compliance exists or not. I contend it does not. TAF has become a purely self-serving private corporation that was given too much trust and leeway. They serve only themselves and their “stakeholder” sponsors…under the chimera of “preserving the public trust in appraisal integrity.”

      There is no uniformity among states in investigative rules or compliance with SR3/SR4 of USPAP. Many now claim they aren’t required to comply with it at all.

      They are misleading the public and their legislative superiors.

    • Avatar HoneyWest says:

      MountainMan I hear you. I quit being an appraiser for many years when I burned out as a trainee. Let the license go. Swore I’d never do another appraisal. Through a series of events related to a family estate, I re-discovered my strengths as an appraiser, and the fees were more agreeable. If I hadn’t been able to re- qualify at a level above Trainee I would not have come back. The gap between being a Trainee and having a profession you enjoy is getting wider all the time. I suggest that you apply for a higher level license before you bail out, in case you want to come back- otherwise your experience credits may be lost, difficult to prove. I would say, hang in there but not sure that would be sound advice.

  14. Avatar Justin M Judge says:

    The shortage of appraisers does not exist. AMC’s should stay. There are enough appraisers right now, the real problem is the current appraiser pool is too OLD and wont keep up with technology to make the appraisal process uniform and faster.


    • Avatar HoneyWest says:

      Justin Judge = Troll.

    • You don’t know what you are talking about. Many of the older appraisers pioneered the very systems we use every day today. Some of us ANALYZED the purported “more modern” so-called more efficient / more uniform ‘systems’ being hustled today and found them to be deceptive, to outright promotions of fraud.

      WE learned USPAP and keep abreast of it. YOU may want to do the same.

  15. Avatar Mountainman says:

    Honeywest I appreciate the info. I currently hold an AL license. From what I heard if I let it laps I have 2 years to renew it. At this point I’m making more money where I’m at. In the next couple years if this profession improves then I will have the option of coming back. Stepping up to AR right now does not seem plausible. Just got my Salesperson license for CA to do that on the side.

  16. Avatar Tom says:

    For me, the downfall for appraisers (and my interest in AMCs) was after the four-year degree, Hours, and EDU requirements were eliminated. Professionally, and historically I can not reference any other profession that would do that …if anyone can, please share.

    The problem here seems to be that as a group, Appraisers lack a solid professional business law, process, and education. What the AMC/Lender cabal has produced, is unjust enrichment-which is illegal. So if the market is saturated with bottom feeders, then ones pretty much have hit the opportunity ceiling.

    • Tom, respectfully, when licensing was implemented there was no requirement for a 4-year degree (nor imho has one EVER been needed). It’s merely an elitist soporific. Conversely, adequate specific education was and remains needed. We are all tested. It’s not an easy test. If it is however defective in some way then perhaps that is where we need to focus.

      Equally important, experience is required. There are no practicum courses that can provide the equivalent of three years experience other than three years of actual experience.

      ALL appraisers are required to take and pass course work in real estate law as it applies to real estate appraisal. We also have to take CE in state & federal laws.

      We have redefined (seemingly) every other appraisal principle in recent years, perhaps it is also time we redefine what it means to be a professional real estate appraiser. If being recognized as professionals were all it takes to assure quality and integrity we would not have such a dishonest Congress in this country (pick from either side). We would not have medical researchers focused on treatment rather than cure. We would not have civil attorneys filing frivolous cases. There would be no malfeasance in public office.

      The trappings of ‘higher education’ (as opposed to lower education for the rest of us?) and mantle of false ‘professionalism’ are used most often to hide dishonest behavior rather than to preclude or eliminate it.

      When a current CA Admin Law Court case is finally settled in Superior Court, I’ll share some of the perjurious claims, statements, and observations made by State officials with ‘higher education’ and “professional” designation.

      FIRREA 1989 as originally drafted had all we needed to assure legitimate ongoing public trust was preserved. But, that was never the real objective to begin with. It’s merely the slogan used to justify everything else.

  17. Avatar Tom Melville says:

    The number of appraisal assignments should increase significantly for the rest of the year 2020 and into 2021. Interest rates I believe will be reduced into the low 2% range to super charge the economy. The lenders are snowballing so much interest and still making millions. My phone and email are busy and off the charts with requests as sometimes I receive 8-10 requests a day. I do complex residential assignments and the easy stuff. Lately my business model is I wait for the rush assignments then charge $900 for a fast sfr report complex properties in the 1.5 to 7 million range of complexity. Then I am asked what is my regular rate for no rush assignment? That is not my business model as I can be at the subject property in 1 day and Noon or 1PM Tomorrow, whereas, other appraisers might get there a week from now. I just do rush assignments and do 2-3 assignments a week. Certified Residential Appraiser, Real Estate Broker Owner, thinking about Plan B to get a Mortgage Loan Originator License, a 20 Class and a test for use after Dec 2021.

  18. Avatar Tom Melville says:

    I just renewed my appraisal license and broker license for another 2 years but I am considering adding a Mortgage Loan Originator License with a 20 hours class-test for the year December 2021, as I will either return to Real Estate Sales as a Discount Brokerage if the appraisal work falls off again by the time. But I will stay optimistic for now and only do rush assignments where I can say I will be there tomorrow at Noon or 1pm. Fee is $700-$900+ depending on complexity. I used to live in San Diego for years and compete with over 2,000 appraisers. I left for Northern California in 2000 and have never looked back.

    • Each area and each appraiser must charge what they require as fair compensation. Personally, I think $900 i s exceptionally low for anything over 1.5 or 2; especially over 3 since that is the amount that triggers higher E&O rates.

      Would or have I don’t million-dollar properties for less? Sure. Not often but its happened years ago. $750 for a million five. In some areas that’s a good fee. Inothers, not so much.

      Charge what you need to in order to assure you are not tempted to take short cuts that could reduce credibility.


Leave a Reply

We welcome critical posts & opposing points of view. We value robust & civil discourse. You may openly disagree, but state your case in an atmosphere of mutual respect, in which everyone has a right to a particular view about the topic of conversation. Please keep remarks about the topic at hand, & PLEASE avoid personal attacks. If the poster gets you upset, it is the Internet, you can walk away from it.

Personal attacks harm the collegial atmosphere we encourage on AppraisersBlogs.

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

xml sitemap

CA Appraisers 50% Decline & Fees Up 76%

by Ann O'Rourke time to read: 2 min